Great Cycling Advocate Killed by repeat Drunk Driver

suffered a serious back injury. This may all sound anecdotal, but I've
seen enough to know that cell phones are a unique hazard and their use
while driving should be banned.

For drivers of motor AND non-motor vehicles. I've seen many
inattentive cyclists on cell phones as well.

Trudi Marrapodi wrote:

In article W38cb.558849$YN5.383334@sccrnsc01, Chuck Anderson
wrote:



Mitch Haley wrote:



David Kerber wrote:




In article , says...




iLiad wrote:




http://www.ghsa.org/html/media/mediacoverage/121802.htm




From what I've read, in accident statistics, "Alcohol-related" means


that the alcohol contributed in some significant way to causing the
accident. A drunk pedestrian on the sidewalk who is killed by a
reckless driver who loses control on the road and runs up on the
sidewalk and kills said drunk pedestrian is not considered an "alcohol-
related" accident.




In the link above, this definition was given:
NHTSA defines an alcohol-related fatality as any that occurred
in an accident where a driver, pedestrian or cyclist had alcohol
detected in their blood. In most states, it is legal to drive with
less than 0.08 percent blood alcohol content.

After seeing that definition of the alcohol relationship with the 17,000
deaths, we see this quote on the same page:
"We have very little evidence that a significant number of people
are dying from cell phones, yet we know that more than 17,000
people died from drunken driving,"




It's not illegal so no one ever follows up with an investigation (cell
phone records could be used to prove it - but there's no reason to).
Annnnd ...... as it is now; who would admit to it?



In some states, it is illegal,

I think you mean in some cities. I am unaware of any state that has
banned hand held phone usage while driving.

but only to talk on a hand-held cell phone.
Hands-free units are fine. But personally, I don't think hands are the
issue. I think cell phones are way too distracting, and I'd just ban them
from use by a driver, period, while the vehicle is in traffic.

How do you tell if someone is on a hands free phone?

(The same way you can tell when a politician is lying?)

Nearly every close call I've had in the last few years has involved a
driver with their cell phone clamped firmly to their head and NOT paying
attention. My daughter, when driving an Access Ride bus said that bus
drivers talk about seeing that inattention due to cell phone usage all
the time. Seen many cars changing lanes without a blinker? In my
experience, odds are very high that the person is on their hand held
cell phone - too busy - too mentally occupied - to reach the blinker
lever. I have a friend who was hit by a cell phone toting driver and and
suffered a serious back injury. This may all sound anecdotal, but I've
seen enough to know that cell phones are a unique hazard and their use
while driving should be banned.



Well, I don't know if I'd call them unique. I think other distractions
while driving are just as bad, and people have to realize just how
dangerous they are. You can get in a terrible accident because of
refereeing a fight with the kids in the back, arguing with the passenger,
switching radio stations to find something you like, eating, or reaching
down to get your wallet from your purse. Until people take all these
behaviors, as well as cell phone use, seriously as driving hazards, there
will continue to be more accidents by distracted drivers.

Some examples you cite are infrequent occurrences - fighting with the
kids in back. Or are the equivalent of blinking (changing the radio
station). I agree there are other dangerous distractions (you didn't
mention applying makeup in the AM commute).

However, many people seem addicted to their cell phones - they are
unable to leave home without talking to someone the whole time they are
"out." I have to repeat and emphasize, my experience is that there is a
new, common, and dangerous distraction out there that has significantly
increased the number of near encounters I have with autos. I could make
money by betting that every encounter involves a cell phone. Yes - I
mean that in most of my encounters* I spy with my little eye - a cell phone.

(*Encounter - often the motorist never even becomes aware of the
encounter, like when I stop to let them out of the driveway they are
exiting, one hand on their ear and too busy to look both ways. Rolling a
stop sign, violating my right of way. They often never even notice my
presence. This happens to me more frequently - and is most often a cell
phone user. Statistics and distracting arguments aside - cell phone
usage while driving needs to be banned.

Some people even stop by the mailbox on the way out of the house, open up
their mail, and read it while driving.

There has to be an attitude developed that even in a world so busy that
one is constantly tempted to multitask, driving is one action that should
be done completely by itself, without trying to accomplish anything else
at the same time.


I couldn't agree more.

--
*****************************
Chuck Anderson • Boulder, CO
http://www.CycleTourist.com
Integrity is obvious.
The lack of it is common.
*****************************

On Wed, 24 Sep 2003 21:05:13 GMT, Chuck Anderson
wrote:
Hands-free units are fine. But personally, I don't think hands are the
issue. I think cell phones are way too distracting, and I'd just ban
them from use by a driver, period, while the vehicle is in traffic.

What I want to know is how talking on a hands-free phone
is any different than conversing with passengers who are
actually in the vehicle.

How do you tell if someone is on a hands free phone?
(The same way you can tell when a politician is lying?)

Sounds like a valid formula.

--
Rick Onanian

Tanya Quinn wrote:

suffered a serious back injury. This may all sound anecdotal, but I've
seen enough to know that cell phones are a unique hazard and their use
while driving should be banned.



For drivers of motor AND non-motor vehicles. I've seen many
inattentive cyclists on cell phones as well.


I see more and more all the time - still not near as many as cars - but
I agree that it is also a real problem.

Pedestrians often present the worst hazard. Everyone has paced back and
forth like some CEO when talking on a cordless phone. Nothing like
playing hit the monkey with someone pacing back and forth across the
bike path (sometimes a major thoroughfare in Boulder), head down,
talking to someone somewhere else. When I get close to these oblivious
people, I hold my head to my ear and firmly say, "Hello?!, can you hear
me now?"

Flagstaff Mountain, here in Boulder, is a common excellent workout - 3.5
miles and 1500 feet of climbing - grades from 4% - 12%. One day in the
middle of the switch backing ascent, I heard someone ahead talking "to
me," so I looked up and saw a cyclist descending, talking on his cell
phone (this is a *serious* descent). What made me laugh out loud,
though, was that as he slowed to a stop he said, "are you trying to kill
me? I'm on my way down Flagstaff." He'd answered his phone on the descent.

Bo-Zo.

--
*****************************
Chuck Anderson • Boulder, CO
http://www.CycleTourist.com
Integrity is obvious.
The lack of it is common.
*****************************

On Wed, 24 Sep 2003 21:18:43 GMT, Chuck Anderson
wrote:
people, I hold my head to my ear and firmly say, "Hello?!, can you hear

Neat trick; then you can hear the noises your head makes.

G

--
Rick Onanian

Chuck Anderson wrote:
They often never even notice my
presence. This happens to me more frequently - and is most often a cell
phone user. Statistics and distracting arguments aside - cell phone
usage while driving needs to be banned.

So we have established, anecdotally, a correlation between cell phone
use and inattentive, idiotic driving. The remaining question is whether
the cell phone makes the idiot, or if the phone users were idiots before
they picked up the phone.
Mitch.

Rick Onanian wrote:
What I want to know is how talking on a hands-free phone
is any different than conversing with passengers who are
actually in the vehicle.

It rarely takes much effort to hear those sitting beside you.
Cell phone deciphering can be intense work.

The passengers in the car can see what's going on and know
when they have to shut up and let you drive.
Mitch

....stuff deleted

Well, I don't know if I'd call them unique. I think other distractions
while driving are just as bad, and people have to realize just how
dangerous they are. You can get in a terrible accident because of
refereeing a fight with the kids in the back, arguing with the passenger,
switching radio stations to find something you like, eating, or reaching
down to get your wallet from your purse. Until people take all these
behaviors, as well as cell phone use, seriously as driving hazards, there
will continue to be more accidents by distracted drivers.


Insurance actuaries have known for years that smokers have more accidents
than non-smokers. The cause is the same as for cell phone users, divided
attention or inattention during driving. Nobody has banned smoking while
driving, though it is nearly as likely as cell phones to cause accidents.

Some people even stop by the mailbox on the way out of the house, open up
their mail, and read it while driving.


I routinely observe some pretty bizzare activities done while driving
including such things as blow-drying hair (using both hands, of course,
since you must pat your head or use a comb when doing same), reading (again,
with both hands, sometimes with the newspaper blocking the view ahead, but
don't fear, the driver does usually drop the paper every few moments to see
if things have changed - real confidence builder, that one), and even
playing games on electronic devices. Driving is not considered a serious
activity by most people, especially when traffic is heavy and slow moving.

Frankly, these folks are downright frightening.

Rick

In article ,
says...
On Wed, 24 Sep 2003 21:05:13 GMT, Chuck Anderson
wrote:
Hands-free units are fine. But personally, I don't think hands are the
issue. I think cell phones are way too distracting, and I'd just ban
them from use by a driver, period, while the vehicle is in traffic.

What I want to know is how talking on a hands-free phone
is any different than conversing with passengers who are
actually in the vehicle.

Because the passengers will quiet down when they can seen you are going
to be busy with traffic jams, complex intersections, etc. The ones on
the phone do not. Plus if it rings while you are in the middle of
merging on to the interstate by squeezing between two semi's, that can
be a major distraction at a very bad time even if you don't answer it.
This is personal experience speaking, BTW.

--
Dave Kerber
Fight spam: remove the ns_ from the return address before replying!

REAL programmers write self-modifying code.

In article ,
(Tanya Quinn) wrote:

suffered a serious back injury. This may all sound anecdotal, but I've
seen enough to know that cell phones are a unique hazard and their use
while driving should be banned.

For drivers of motor AND non-motor vehicles. I've seen many
inattentive cyclists on cell phones as well.

Doesn't that just frost you? I've seen a few too. And I think it's fair to
say that while one-handed driving is not the greatest practice in the
world, one-handed cycling is even stupider.

I'd also like to note that I know someone who had a terrible accident and
a back injury that required months of recovery because of the old
reaching-in-the-purse distraction mistake...so in that sense, cell phones
are not unique as a hazard.
--
Trudi