Handebar broke off - nasty cash

On Sunday, August 4, 2019 at 5:09:13 PM UTC+1, AMuzi wrote:
On 8/4/2019 10:14 AM, Tom Kunich wrote:
On Saturday, August 3, 2019 at 11:31:40 AM UTC-7, Joerg wrote:
Folks,

Had a nasty crash about three months ago. Long story short my handlebar
broke without any warning. There was no cause such as a speed bump or
pothole.

http://analogconsultants.com/ng/bike/Handlebar1.jpg

The handlebar was not cheap, an ITM Mondial. It seems they botched the
design in that they used a non-coated steel stiffener tube in the
center. This corroded the aluminum from the inside out, interestingly in
riding direction. Possibly because that's where the headwinds are
hitting it and maybe cause condensation:

http://analogconsultants.com/ng/bike/Handlebar1.jpg

Luckily it didn't happen 1/2h earlier where I was coming down a steep
hill at more than 40mph, with a rocky drainage ditch. It happened at a
leisurely travel speed of 15-17mph. Thanks to the fact that it was a
very wide bike lane I had space to roll and at the end I skidded to
avoid traffic. In the lane I'd have crashed into the path of vehicles.
About the only body part that wasn't hurt was my head, thanks to the helmet.

http://analogconsultants.com/ng/bike/Helmet1.jpg

I am back in the saddle. I no longer trust aluminum and certainly not
any kind of plastic stuff so the road bike now has a flat steel MTB
handlebar. Put MeetLocks ergo handles on it, rides nicely.

As a side note I cycled by the crash site a week ago. I still saw the
scrape marks on the asphalt and debris from my bike which I cleaned up..
Interestingly all the blood was gone. Maybe a wild animal has licked it
clean.

--
Regards, Joerg

http://www.analogconsultants.com/

Very sorry to hear of your injuries Joerg. Let me again mention a product called Second Skin that does a remarkable job of speeding healing and reducing pain.

Also again, Trek through Bontrager is presently making a helmet called "Wavecell" where the padding, instead of Styrofoam is a three-D printed padding. The original documentation stated that it provided 28 times more protection against concussion but the latest documentation now says 48 times. Being printed it is easily changed so perhaps that wasn't a writing error but actual improvement. A helmet cannot save your life, but it could make your life a whole lot easier if you avoid a serious concussion like I had.

I have looked at tests of aluminum and carbon fiber bars. Properly constructed, the carbon fiber bar has almost infinite fatigue resistance whereas an aluminum bar does not. Strangely enough a steel bar is even less if it is stressed in the fatigue zone. The problem is that usually steel or aluminum will bend in a collision whereas carbon fiber will break.

Watch yourself. We can do without losing members of this group that have good sense. We're so few.


In theory, in a perfect world, full of perfect (not human)
beings, sure.

https://duckduckgo.com/?q=carbon+han...es&ia=ima ges

--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org/
Open every day since 1 April, 1971

Steel handlebars do me fine. I really fail to see that there's a problem with steel handlebars that glass threads in a resin matrix solves.

Andre Jute
Of course there is a place for useless premium-price products. Just don't expect me to buy them.

On Sunday, August 4, 2019 at 7:58:0javascript:;2 AM UTC-7, Joerg wrote:
On 2019-08-03 18:06, jbeattie wrote:
On Saturday, August 3, 2019 at 11:31:40 AM UTC-7, Joerg wrote:
Folks,

Had a nasty crash about three months ago. Long story short my
handlebar broke without any warning. There was no cause such as a
speed bump or pothole.

http://analogconsultants.com/ng/bike/Handlebar1.jpg

The handlebar was not cheap, an ITM Mondial. It seems they botched
the design in that they used a non-coated steel stiffener tube in
the center. This corroded the aluminum from the inside out,
interestingly in riding direction. Possibly because that's where
the headwinds are hitting it and maybe cause condensation:

http://analogconsultants.com/ng/bike/Handlebar1.jpg

Luckily it didn't happen 1/2h earlier where I was coming down a
steep hill at more than 40mph, with a rocky drainage ditch. It
happened at a leisurely travel speed of 15-17mph. Thanks to the
fact that it was a very wide bike lane I had space to roll and at
the end I skidded to avoid traffic. In the lane I'd have crashed
into the path of vehicles. About the only body part that wasn't
hurt was my head, thanks to the helmet.

http://analogconsultants.com/ng/bike/Helmet1.jpg

I am back in the saddle. I no longer trust aluminum and certainly
not any kind of plastic stuff so the road bike now has a flat steel
MTB handlebar. Put MeetLocks ergo handles on it, rides nicely.

As a side note I cycled by the crash site a week ago. I still saw
the scrape marks on the asphalt and debris from my bike which I
cleaned up. Interestingly all the blood was gone. Maybe a wild
animal has licked it clean.

Well, I'm glad to hear you're O.K. I broke a modern (2006-ish)
Cinelli bar in the same place after less than three years in service,
but it happened relatively slowly. I thought the brake lever clamp
had slipped but realized my lever was moving because the bar was
breaking off. I rode the rest of the way to work with one-sided bars,
holding on to the dangling broken section. No crash.


In hindsight I was lucky even with the crash. To get out of Cameron Park
to the west without using a busy two-lane county road you have to cross
a hill. The descent is very steep and cyclists tend to "let'er rip",
going down there at well over 40mph. So did I. Since the crash I don't
do that no more. There is a drainage ditch with boulders to the right
and it dead-ends into a busy road at the end of that descent.


I'm still riding with aluminum bars. They are generally safe. And
don't think that steel is going to save the day.



That looks like a very cheap handlebar. I mean something serious for MTB
use. That's what I have on it now. It's heavy. Not having a dopbar took
getting used to, might cost me a few minutes on longer trips. Though I
never spent much time in the drops.

Amazingly three car drivers stopped immediately and almost got into an
argument about who gets to bring me home, despite the bleeding. A fellow
immigrant drove me home. Almost new car, quite fancy, he just turned the
floor mats around in case of blood. He had a nice bike in the back and
put mine on top. Couldn't believe it. There are a lot of good people in
this world.

What surprised me was how much muscle and power one can lose in two
months. My avg speed down in the flatlands dropped from 15-16mph to
almost 12mph. Creeping back up and now at 14mph but that took nearly a
month. I still feel like a slowpoke.

Joerg, I'm hijacking your thread for a moment.

I was on a ride today with my riding buddy of 19 years when I touched his rear wheel with my front and went down. Dopey and not something I've done in decades. I was changing bottles and kind of bobbling around, expecting him to go straight when he turned. It was low speed, so no "helmet saved my life" claim. Anyway, I twisted my back as I fell, and when I hit the ground -- every last O2 molecule was knocked out of my lungs. 30 years ago, I would have jumped up and pretended it didn't happen. Instead, I just stayed down, wondering if I would ever get up. As you grow old, dopey little crashes are so much more consequential. The last 30 miles of that ride were the hardest I've ridden in my life. My friend was on fire, and we were really cooking before the mishap -- 62 miles and about 4000 feet of climbing, mostly rollers with a few multi-mile climbs on the way home. Beautiful, hot day, but a struggle to get home.

-- Jay Beattie.

On Sat, 3 Aug 2019 18:06:32 -0700 (PDT), jbeattie wrote:
On Saturday, August 3, 2019 at 11:31:40 AM UTC-7, Joerg wrote:
Folks,

Had a nasty crash about three months ago. Long story short my handlebar broke without any
warning. There was no cause such as a speed bump or pothole.

http://analogconsultants.com/ng/bike/Handlebar1.jpg

The handlebar was not cheap, an ITM Mondial. It seems they botched the design in that they
used a non-coated steel stiffener tube in the center. This corroded the aluminum from the
inside out, interestingly in riding direction. Possibly because that's where the headwinds
are hitting it and maybe cause condensation:

http://analogconsultants.com/ng/bike/Handlebar1.jpg

Luckily it didn't happen 1/2h earlier where I was coming down a steep hill at more than
40mph, with a rocky drainage ditch. It happened at a leisurely travel speed of 15-17mph.
Thanks to the fact that it was a very wide bike lane I had space to roll and at the end I
skidded to avoid traffic. In the lane I'd have crashed into the path of vehicles. About the
only body part that wasn't hurt was my head, thanks to the helmet.

http://analogconsultants.com/ng/bike/Helmet1.jpg

I am back in the saddle. I no longer trust aluminum and certainly not any kind of plastic
stuff so the road bike now has a flat steel MTB handlebar. Put MeetLocks ergo handles on it,
rides nicely.

As a side note I cycled by the crash site a week ago. I still saw the scrape marks on the
asphalt and debris from my bike which I cleaned up. Interestingly all the blood was gone.
Maybe a wild animal has licked it clean.

Well, I'm glad to hear you're O.K. I broke a modern (2006-ish) Cinelli bar in the same place
after less than three years in service, but it happened relatively slowly. I thought the
brake lever clamp had slipped but realized my lever was moving because the bar was breaking
off. I rode the rest of the way to work with one-sided bars, holding on to the dangling
broken section. No crash.

I'm still riding with aluminum bars. They are generally safe. And don't think that steel is
going to save the day.

Do I recall correctly that Jobst wrote that he used steel bars for decades (possibly the same
ones). Of course, he was a human fatigue testing rig with his size and the kinds of rides he
liked to do...

On Sat, 03 Aug 2019 11:31:50 -0700, Joerg wrote:
Folks,

Had a nasty crash about three months ago. Long story short my handlebar broke without any
warning. There was no cause such as a speed bump or pothole.

Joerg, glad you're back to write about it. Hope you are all healed up.

I would have to consider giving up riding if I could only use drop bars. But if that weren't the case, I think the latest trend towards 31.8mm bars with gradual tapers to the grip sections would be the best news in a long time. Get one of those that isn't too light and isn't made of plastic, and worry not.

My daily rider these days has bars that are 22.2mm throughout, made of chromoly, and not remotely lightweight. Branded Specialized and made by Nitto about thirty-five years ago.

On 8/4/2019 8:37 PM, jbeattie wrote:
As you grow old, dopey little crashes are so much more consequential.

This is certainly true. And of course, spectacular crashes are even more
consequential.

Someone asked me today "What's the fastest you've ever gone on a
bicycle?" I answered "54 miles per hour. But I wouldn't do that today."

I think it's entirely reasonable to be aware of our changing
limitations, and to adjust our behavior to account for them. That can
very likely mean descending slower, cornering slower and more
cautiously, maintaining greater distance between riding partners,
watching further down the road for bad surfaces or potential traffic
conflicts, etc.

I've ridden avidly as an adult for over 45 years. In that time, I've had
two moving on-road falls, one at ~10 mph, one at ~3 mph. I don't intend
to have another, and I've given up the risky variety of mountain biking.

--
- Frank Krygowski

On 4/8/19 4:31 am, Joerg wrote:
Folks,

Had a nasty crash about three months ago. Long story short my handlebar
broke without any warning. There was no cause such as a speed bump or
pothole.

http://analogconsultants.com/ng/bike/Handlebar1.jpg

The handlebar was not cheap, an ITM Mondial. It seems they botched the
design in that they used a non-coated steel stiffener tube in the
center. This corroded the aluminum from the inside out, interestingly in
riding direction. Possibly because that's where the headwinds are
hitting it and maybe cause condensation:

http://analogconsultants.com/ng/bike/Handlebar1.jpg

Luckily it didn't happen 1/2h earlier where I was coming down a steep
hill at more than 40mph, with a rocky drainage ditch. It happened at a
leisurely travel speed of 15-17mph. Thanks to the fact that it was a
very wide bike lane I had space to roll and at the end I skidded to
avoid traffic. In the lane I'd have crashed into the path of vehicles.
About the only body part that wasn't hurt was my head, thanks to the
helmet.

http://analogconsultants.com/ng/bike/Helmet1.jpg

I am back in the saddle. I no longer trust aluminum and certainly not
any kind of plastic stuff so the road bike now has a flat steel MTB
handlebar. Put MeetLocks ergo handles on it, rides nicely.

As a side note I cycled by the crash site a week ago. I still saw the
scrape marks on the asphalt and debris from my bike which I cleaned up.
Interestingly all the blood was gone. Maybe a wild animal has licked it
clean.


Glad you're ok, Joerg.

I broke a steel steerer once, and in a separate incident a steel BB
axle. Both broke without any warning. Thankfully I didn't crash either
time. Oh, I've also broken a few steel axles and my wife broke a steel
bicycle chain.

Having also broken aluminium handle bars, a rim or two and a pedal, that
I remember, I'm at a loss to know what is safe to use.

Though I've heard lots of stories about broken carbon fibre reinforced
plastic parts, I haven't broken any of that stuff yet personally. I
guess that's why I happily go on using my CFRP forks, cranks, brake
levers, and so on.

One day though, there won't be a material left to make safe bicycles from.

--
JS

On Monday, August 5, 2019 at 1:37:06 AM UTC+1, jbeattie wrote:
On Sunday, August 4, 2019 at 7:58:0javascript:;2 AM UTC-7, Joerg wrote:
On 2019-08-03 18:06, jbeattie wrote:
On Saturday, August 3, 2019 at 11:31:40 AM UTC-7, Joerg wrote:
Folks,

Had a nasty crash about three months ago. Long story short my
handlebar broke without any warning. There was no cause such as a
speed bump or pothole.

http://analogconsultants.com/ng/bike/Handlebar1.jpg

The handlebar was not cheap, an ITM Mondial. It seems they botched
the design in that they used a non-coated steel stiffener tube in
the center. This corroded the aluminum from the inside out,
interestingly in riding direction. Possibly because that's where
the headwinds are hitting it and maybe cause condensation:

http://analogconsultants.com/ng/bike/Handlebar1.jpg

Luckily it didn't happen 1/2h earlier where I was coming down a
steep hill at more than 40mph, with a rocky drainage ditch. It
happened at a leisurely travel speed of 15-17mph. Thanks to the
fact that it was a very wide bike lane I had space to roll and at
the end I skidded to avoid traffic. In the lane I'd have crashed
into the path of vehicles. About the only body part that wasn't
hurt was my head, thanks to the helmet.

http://analogconsultants.com/ng/bike/Helmet1.jpg

I am back in the saddle. I no longer trust aluminum and certainly
not any kind of plastic stuff so the road bike now has a flat steel
MTB handlebar. Put MeetLocks ergo handles on it, rides nicely.

As a side note I cycled by the crash site a week ago. I still saw
the scrape marks on the asphalt and debris from my bike which I
cleaned up. Interestingly all the blood was gone. Maybe a wild
animal has licked it clean.

Well, I'm glad to hear you're O.K. I broke a modern (2006-ish)
Cinelli bar in the same place after less than three years in service,
but it happened relatively slowly. I thought the brake lever clamp
had slipped but realized my lever was moving because the bar was
breaking off. I rode the rest of the way to work with one-sided bars,
holding on to the dangling broken section. No crash.


In hindsight I was lucky even with the crash. To get out of Cameron Park
to the west without using a busy two-lane county road you have to cross
a hill. The descent is very steep and cyclists tend to "let'er rip",
going down there at well over 40mph. So did I. Since the crash I don't
do that no more. There is a drainage ditch with boulders to the right
and it dead-ends into a busy road at the end of that descent.


I'm still riding with aluminum bars. They are generally safe. And
don't think that steel is going to save the day.



That looks like a very cheap handlebar. I mean something serious for MTB
use. That's what I have on it now. It's heavy. Not having a dopbar took
getting used to, might cost me a few minutes on longer trips. Though I
never spent much time in the drops.

Amazingly three car drivers stopped immediately and almost got into an
argument about who gets to bring me home, despite the bleeding. A fellow
immigrant drove me home. Almost new car, quite fancy, he just turned the
floor mats around in case of blood. He had a nice bike in the back and
put mine on top. Couldn't believe it. There are a lot of good people in
this world.

What surprised me was how much muscle and power one can lose in two
months. My avg speed down in the flatlands dropped from 15-16mph to
almost 12mph. Creeping back up and now at 14mph but that took nearly a
month. I still feel like a slowpoke.

Joerg, I'm hijacking your thread for a moment.

I was on a ride today with my riding buddy of 19 years when I touched his rear wheel with my front and went down. Dopey and not something I've done in decades. I was changing bottles and kind of bobbling around, expecting him to go straight when he turned. It was low speed, so no "helmet saved my life" claim. Anyway, I twisted my back as I fell, and when I hit the ground -- every last O2 molecule was knocked out of my lungs. 30 years ago, I would have jumped up and pretended it didn't happen. Instead, I just stayed down, wondering if I would ever get up. As you grow old, dopey little crashes are so much more consequential. The last 30 miles of that ride were the hardest I've ridden in my life. My friend was on fire, and we were really cooking before the mishap -- 62 miles and about 4000 feet of climbing, mostly rollers with a few multi-mile climbs on the way home. Beautiful, hot day, but a struggle to get home.

-- Jay Beattie.

I'm sorry to hear you fell, Jay, and glad that you're okay.

Somebody on my ride was saying only the other day that crashes at our age are so much more consequential. Though they were talking about breaking a hip, I thought of that when a couple of days later I fell while dismounting from my bike (I hooked the mixte bar between my foot and its heel) and landed so heavily that the deep dent in my helmet looks like the most dangerous accident I've had in 30 years of cycling -- from a standstill! The helmet saved me from a gash on the head, painful stitches, and perhaps even a concussion. That's definitely worth its price.

Like you I managed to finish the painting I stopped to make and the rest of the ride, though not such an heroic distance, but when I got home I was sore and shaking with reaction, whereas in younger days I would have dismissed anything less than broken bones or plastic surgery as "a scratch, don't fuss".

Andre Jute
Not an old crock

On Monday, August 5, 2019 at 3:38:39 AM UTC+1, Chalo wrote:
I would have to consider giving up riding if I could only use drop bars. But if that weren't the case, I think the latest trend towards 31.8mm bars with gradual tapers to the grip sections would be the best news in a long time. Get one of those that isn't too light and isn't made of plastic, and worry not.

My daily rider these days has bars that are 22.2mm throughout, made of chromoly, and not remotely lightweight. Branded Specialized and made by Nitto about thirty-five years ago.

We have a government-supported bicycle scheme whereby workers can get a subsidy of a bicycle they intend to ride to work. At least one LBS where I saw the process, sell these people an entirely unsuitable bike for a commuter, and then sell them drop bars among other expensive extras, and charge them for unboxing the bike they'll actually ride away. I bought a bunch of North Road handlebars that had been on those bikes for a fiver each, and resolved to give that LBS a miss; I could understand how he bragged to me that he belonged to six "exclusive and expensive" gyms.

The handlebars are Uno-Kalloy, steel, and have served me faithfully for many years.

Then I bought a Swiss n'lock kit (it unlocks the stem from the steerer tube and thus makes the big unrideable and less attractive to thieves) and my kit came with a set of North Road bars with a cable inside (very neat packaging -- you pull out the cable and one end remains inside the hendlebar and the spike in the loose end fits in a hole which is locked.released by the key which operated the rest of the n'lock) and guess what -- the bars were the same Uno Kalloy steel bars I already have, only painted in a smarter black. These have been in use for ten years and show little sign of wear.

I would never dare use aluminum bars that long, if you could get me to use them at all. As for carbon fibre, pull the other one.

Andre Jute
Not reckless

jbeattie wrote:
On Sunday, August 4, 2019 at 7:58:0javascript:;2 AM UTC-7, Joerg wrote:
On 2019-08-03 18:06, jbeattie wrote:
On Saturday, August 3, 2019 at 11:31:40 AM UTC-7, Joerg wrote:
Folks,

Had a nasty crash about three months ago. Long story short my
handlebar broke without any warning. There was no cause such as a
speed bump or pothole.

http://analogconsultants.com/ng/bike/Handlebar1.jpg

The handlebar was not cheap, an ITM Mondial. It seems they botched
the design in that they used a non-coated steel stiffener tube in
the center. This corroded the aluminum from the inside out,
interestingly in riding direction. Possibly because that's where
the headwinds are hitting it and maybe cause condensation:

http://analogconsultants.com/ng/bike/Handlebar1.jpg

Luckily it didn't happen 1/2h earlier where I was coming down a
steep hill at more than 40mph, with a rocky drainage ditch. It
happened at a leisurely travel speed of 15-17mph. Thanks to the
fact that it was a very wide bike lane I had space to roll and at
the end I skidded to avoid traffic. In the lane I'd have crashed
into the path of vehicles. About the only body part that wasn't
hurt was my head, thanks to the helmet.

http://analogconsultants.com/ng/bike/Helmet1.jpg

I am back in the saddle. I no longer trust aluminum and certainly
not any kind of plastic stuff so the road bike now has a flat steel
MTB handlebar. Put MeetLocks ergo handles on it, rides nicely.

As a side note I cycled by the crash site a week ago. I still saw
the scrape marks on the asphalt and debris from my bike which I
cleaned up. Interestingly all the blood was gone. Maybe a wild
animal has licked it clean.

Well, I'm glad to hear you're O.K. I broke a modern (2006-ish)
Cinelli bar in the same place after less than three years in service,
but it happened relatively slowly. I thought the brake lever clamp
had slipped but realized my lever was moving because the bar was
breaking off. I rode the rest of the way to work with one-sided bars,
holding on to the dangling broken section. No crash.


In hindsight I was lucky even with the crash. To get out of Cameron Park
to the west without using a busy two-lane county road you have to cross
a hill. The descent is very steep and cyclists tend to "let'er rip",
going down there at well over 40mph. So did I. Since the crash I don't
do that no more. There is a drainage ditch with boulders to the right
and it dead-ends into a busy road at the end of that descent.


I'm still riding with aluminum bars. They are generally safe. And
don't think that steel is going to save the day.



That looks like a very cheap handlebar. I mean something serious for MTB
use. That's what I have on it now. It's heavy. Not having a dopbar took
getting used to, might cost me a few minutes on longer trips. Though I
never spent much time in the drops.

Amazingly three car drivers stopped immediately and almost got into an
argument about who gets to bring me home, despite the bleeding. A fellow
immigrant drove me home. Almost new car, quite fancy, he just turned the
floor mats around in case of blood. He had a nice bike in the back and
put mine on top. Couldn't believe it. There are a lot of good people in
this world.

What surprised me was how much muscle and power one can lose in two
months. My avg speed down in the flatlands dropped from 15-16mph to
almost 12mph. Creeping back up and now at 14mph but that took nearly a
month. I still feel like a slowpoke.

Joerg, I'm hijacking your thread for a moment.

I was on a ride today with my riding buddy of 19 years when I touched his
rear wheel with my front and went down. Dopey and not something I've
done in decades. I was changing bottles and kind of bobbling around,
expecting him to go straight when he turned. It was low speed, so no
"helmet saved my life" claim. Anyway, I twisted my back as I fell, and
when I hit the ground -- every last O2 molecule was knocked out of my
lungs. 30 years ago, I would have jumped up and pretended it didn't
happen. Instead, I just stayed down, wondering if I would ever get up.
As you grow old, dopey little crashes are so much more consequential.
The last 30 miles of that ride were the hardest I've ridden in my life.
My friend was on fire, and we were really cooking before the mishap -- 62
miles and about 4000 feet of climbing, mostly rollers with a few
multi-mile climbs on the way home. Beautiful, hot day, but a struggle to get home.

-- Jay Beattie.


Yeah sadly we don’t bounce and bend as much anymore. Things tend to break
now.

Back to Joerg, glad you are back on the bike.

--
duane