kickstand recommendation?

I know this may be a strange request for this group, but here goes....

A buddy of mine recently bought a nice high-end old-school chromoly
hardtail mtn. bike (with slicks) for commuting. Round trip is close to
40 miles. He is one of these super fit guys who probably couldn't
really mind (but can tell) the weight difference between riding a
Schwinn Varsity or a top-of-line bike.

This bike is loaded with rear panniers. He insists on a kickstand. I
keep on trying to talk him out of one. But he is about to take matters
into his own hands and slap on any old kickstand himself. I'm afraid
he will crimp the tubes while he puts it on (he is pretty much a
gorilla), so I offered to install one for him.

Are rear mounted kickstands (the ones that fasten near the rear hub on
seatstay & chainstay) generally better than the ones mounted right
behind the bottom bracket? I've seen the bottom bracket ones do all
sorts of damage to a frame (generally as they loosen and the owners try
to "remedy" the situation by over-tightening).

Are there alternative kickstands that are the least damaging to frames
than others that you guys would recommend?

On 15 Nov 2005 00:58:36 -0800, "damyth"
wrote:

This bike is loaded with rear panniers. He insists on a kickstand. I
keep on trying to talk him out of one.

I don't understand what you have against kick stands -- they can make
a lot of sense.

Are rear mounted kickstands (the ones that fasten near the rear hub on
seatstay & chainstay) generally better than the ones mounted right
behind the bottom bracket?

Well, I only have experience with unloaded road bikes with kickstands,
and the one that mounted at the rear worked great. Whether it could
handle a heavier set-up with panniers I don't know.

JT

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damyth schrieb:

This bike is loaded with rear panniers. He insists on a kickstand.
I'm afraid he will crimp the tubes while he puts it on

Are rear mounted kickstands
generally better than the ones mounted right
behind the bottom bracket? I've seen the bottom bracket ones do all
sorts of damage to a frame

Are there alternative kickstands that are the least damaging to frames
than others that you guys would recommend?

There nothing wrong with a kickstand, center mounted version
are not demage the frame when the kickstand mounted on kickstandplate
(welded behind the BB) if the frame dont have such plate chose a rear
version, the best kickstands are from Hebie, these are much better
then all the chinese crap.
The Hebie 630 is a center version, and the Hebie 611 is the best rear
version, I use the 611 on my travell bike with heavy loaded panniers
and its perfect and very durable.
http://hebieusa.com/
http://www.hebie.de/

Volker

On 15 Nov 2005 00:58:36 -0800, "damyth"
wrote:

Are rear mounted kickstands (the ones that fasten near the rear hub on
seatstay & chainstay) generally better than the ones mounted right
behind the bottom bracket? I've seen the bottom bracket ones do all
sorts of damage to a frame (generally as they loosen and the owners try
to "remedy" the situation by over-tightening).

Are there alternative kickstands that are the least damaging to frames
than others that you guys would recommend?

What you need is a frame with a kickstand mount brazeon between the BB and
the tyre. Other than that, since it presumably isn't an option, I didn't
have a problem with the rear-mounted kickstand I had on a bike for a
while. Except that the bike was unstable when standing on it, that is.
Especially with stuff on the rack.

If you're worried about loosening, use stainless steel bolts with two lock
washers [1] (one for the nut and one for the bolt) and a nylock nut. No
way that baby's getting loose without you wanting it.

Also: It's his damn frame, if he wants to damage it by overtightening
bolts on it, it's his business.


Jasper

[1] Those would be the washers that have teeth on either side to allow the
bolt to be tightened, but not easily loosened.

The ones that mount on the rear triangle seem to be more stable, but
for a loaded bike, no kickstand is really a good choice. A center stand
is better, but very rare and hard to find. Saw some at Urban Bikes in
Chicago a few years ago.

I got a traditional behind BB stand for momma's shopping bike a while
back at the Target discount chain. $4 and the best stand of that type
I've ever used. The length is adjustable with an allen bolt secured
telescoping arm. Best part was being able to buy underwear and a crock
pot at the same store. What will they think of next? Anyhow, it's much
better than the "standard" "Greenfield" type you most often see.

On 15 Nov 2005 00:58:36 -0800, "damyth"
wrote:

I know this may be a strange request for this group, but here goes....

A buddy of mine recently bought a nice high-end old-school chromoly
hardtail mtn. bike (with slicks) for commuting. Round trip is close to
40 miles. He is one of these super fit guys who probably couldn't
really mind (but can tell) the weight difference between riding a
Schwinn Varsity or a top-of-line bike.

This bike is loaded with rear panniers. He insists on a kickstand. I
keep on trying to talk him out of one. But he is about to take matters
into his own hands and slap on any old kickstand himself. I'm afraid
he will crimp the tubes while he puts it on (he is pretty much a
gorilla), so I offered to install one for him.

Are rear mounted kickstands (the ones that fasten near the rear hub on
seatstay & chainstay) generally better than the ones mounted right
behind the bottom bracket?

In my experience, no...and they have drawbacks with panniers anyway.

I've seen the bottom bracket ones do all
sorts of damage to a frame (generally as they loosen and the owners try
to "remedy" the situation by over-tightening).

Any frame can be damaged by poorly-chosen or badly-installed
accessories.

Are there alternative kickstands that are the least damaging to frames
than others that you guys would recommend?

In the only instance in which I had similar concerns, I buttressed the
chainstay cavity by forming some epoxy putty into the gap and then
lightly securing the kickstand clamp onto it while it set; when the
putty cured after about 24 hours, I removed the bolt, applied Loctite,
and then installed and tightened the kickstand the rest of the way.
It's still there. That wasn't an mtb, though; it was a light roadie
frame that had been swapped over to hybrid usage. The typical mtb
frame is much more robust.

IME a decent Cr-Mo mtb frame should not have any problems with a
kickstand in the conventional location unless there's a
factory-installed anti-chainsuck block or some such in the way.
--
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damyth wrote:

Are rear mounted kickstands generally better than the ones mounted right
behind the bottom bracket?

I would go with a rear mounted kickstand for the simple fact you
can backpedal while the kick stand is down which allows you to clean,
oil, or check your drive train, without having to put your bike on a
stand. You can even walk your bike backward without the crank hitting
the kickstand.

John

damyth wrote:
I know this may be a strange request for this group, but here goes....

A buddy of mine recently bought a nice high-end old-school chromoly
hardtail mtn. bike (with slicks) for commuting. Round trip is close to
40 miles. He is one of these super fit guys who probably couldn't
really mind (but can tell) the weight difference between riding a
Schwinn Varsity or a top-of-line bike.

This bike is loaded with rear panniers. He insists on a kickstand. I
keep on trying to talk him out of one. But he is about to take matters
into his own hands and slap on any old kickstand himself. I'm afraid
he will crimp the tubes while he puts it on (he is pretty much a
gorilla), so I offered to install one for him.

Are rear mounted kickstands (the ones that fasten near the rear hub on
seatstay & chainstay) generally better than the ones mounted right
behind the bottom bracket? I've seen the bottom bracket ones do all
sorts of damage to a frame (generally as they loosen and the owners try
to "remedy" the situation by over-tightening).

Are there alternative kickstands that are the least damaging to frames
than others that you guys would recommend?

You might want to look at the ESGE kickstand. It's strong enough for
tandems. It lifts the rear wheel off the ground (like some motorcyle
stands), so you can also work on the bike while it's down. Beware of
sticker shock... http://harriscyclery.net/site/itemdetails.cfm?ID=1034

I've seen a lot of old steel mountain bikes with kickstands. I don't
think I've ever seen one that has been seriously damaged by the
kickstand.

-Vee

For my touring and commuting bikes I use the Esge/Pletscher twin-
legged center stand, readily available from better bike shops. It
will hold up a bike with fully-loaded panniers quite reliably in my
experience.

--
is Joshua Putnam
http://www.phred.org/~josh/
Books for Bicycle Mechanics and Tinkerers:
http://www.phred.org/~josh/bike/bikebooks.html