AG: Aunt Granny's Advice, or How to become an elderly cyclist:

You don't signal to tell the operators of other vehicles what you have
done. They don't care.

You don't signal to tell the operators of other vehicles what you are
doing. They can see that for themselves.

You signal to tell the operators of other vehicles what you intend to
do.

----------------------------------------------------------------------

When I started riding, I used the signals given in the driver's
manual. I pretty soon noticed that whenever I signaled a right turn,
car drivers waved back.

So I started signaling right turns by pointing right with my right
arm, a mirror image of the left-turn signal given in the book. A few
weeks ago I downloaded the Indiana drivers' manual, and was delighted
to see that this signal had been legalized for the operators of
two-wheeled vehicles.

I don't think the book mentioned the "I'm going straight" signal:
point straight ahead, raising the arm a bit if it needs to be seen by
operators behind you. This is frequently useful information, but
impossible to convey with tail lights.

After I begin a left turn at The Entrance, I swing my arm to point at
my exact destination so that the drivers draining out of the tunnel
know how to be where I ain't. At less-complex intersections, there is
seldom need to signal after entering the intersection.


--
joy beeson at comcast dot net
http://joybeeson.home.comcast.net/
The above message is a Usenet post.
I don't recall having given anyone permission to use it on a Web site.

On Sat, 06 Dec 2014 23:44:10 -0400, Joy Beeson
wrote:


You don't signal to tell the operators of other vehicles what you have
done. They don't care.

You don't signal to tell the operators of other vehicles what you are
doing. They can see that for themselves.

You signal to tell the operators of other vehicles what you intend to
do.

----------------------------------------------------------------------

When I started riding, I used the signals given in the driver's
manual. I pretty soon noticed that whenever I signaled a right turn,
car drivers waved back.

So I started signaling right turns by pointing right with my right
arm, a mirror image of the left-turn signal given in the book. A few
weeks ago I downloaded the Indiana drivers' manual, and was delighted
to see that this signal had been legalized for the operators of
two-wheeled vehicles.

I don't think the book mentioned the "I'm going straight" signal:
point straight ahead, raising the arm a bit if it needs to be seen by
operators behind you. This is frequently useful information, but
impossible to convey with tail lights.

After I begin a left turn at The Entrance, I swing my arm to point at
my exact destination so that the drivers draining out of the tunnel
know how to be where I ain't. At less-complex intersections, there is
seldom need to signal after entering the intersection.


I think that the important thing about hand signals is that other
people understand what you intend to do. If it takes bouncing up and
down and waving your arms over head to indicate that you intend to
turn across six lanes of traffic than I suggest that it is the correct
thing to do.
--
Cheers,

John B.

On 12/6/2014 10:44 PM, Joy Beeson wrote:

You don't signal to tell the operators of other vehicles what you have
done. They don't care.

You don't signal to tell the operators of other vehicles what you are
doing. They can see that for themselves.

You signal to tell the operators of other vehicles what you intend to
do.

There are a few situations where I use signals to tell motorists what
_they_ are supposed to do.

The simplest situation occurs at a four-way stop. Often a motorist will
approach from my right to arrive the same time, or just before, I do, so
he has the right of way. Many of those motorists won't proceed, perhaps
because they expect me to run the stop sign. Some will enter
"politeness wars" ("You go." "No, you go.") that delay everyone. I
solve this by waving "Go ahead" as I'm coming to a stop, so they know I
won't ride in front of them.

The newest situation occurs at our new roundabout, the first in our
county. Our motorists are not geniuses, and many are not using it
properly. Usually their mistake is to treat the yield signs as stop
signs and delay everyone, but I've seen cars approach far too fast when
I'm in the circle, as if they're not going to yield to me. In that
case, I've held up my hand in a traffic cop's "Stop!" gesture.

--
- Frank Krygowski

Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 12/6/2014 10:44 PM, Joy Beeson wrote:


You don't signal to tell the operators of other vehicles what you have
done. They don't care.

You don't signal to tell the operators of other vehicles what you are
doing. They can see that for themselves.

You signal to tell the operators of other vehicles what you intend to
do.


There are a few situations where I use signals to tell motorists what
_they_ are supposed to do.

The simplest situation occurs at a four-way stop. Often a motorist will
approach from my right to arrive the same time, or just before, I do, so
he has the right of way. Many of those motorists won't proceed, perhaps
because they expect me to run the stop sign. Some will enter
"politeness wars" ("You go." "No, you go.") that delay everyone. I
solve this by waving "Go ahead" as I'm coming to a stop, so they know I
won't ride in front of them.

The newest situation occurs at our new roundabout, the first in our
county. Our motorists are not geniuses, and many are not using it
properly. Usually their mistake is to treat the yield signs as stop
signs and delay everyone, but I've seen cars approach far too fast when
I'm in the circle, as if they're not going to yield to me. In that
case, I've held up my hand in a traffic cop's "Stop!" gesture.


Here in Massachusetts, it seems traffic circle, or roundabout Yield signs are
interpreted by motorists as "everyone must stop for me".

This is true when I'm in the rotary whether I'm on a bicycle or in my big
honkin', global warming, Dodge Ram 4x4 hemi!

I use hand signals only when I'm turning, just as the operator of a motor
vehicle does (or should).


SMH

On Sun, 07 Dec 2014 11:02:42 -0500, Frank Krygowski
wrote:

On 12/6/2014 10:44 PM, Joy Beeson wrote:

You don't signal to tell the operators of other vehicles what you have
done. They don't care.

You don't signal to tell the operators of other vehicles what you are
doing. They can see that for themselves.

You signal to tell the operators of other vehicles what you intend to
do.

There are a few situations where I use signals to tell motorists what
_they_ are supposed to do.

The simplest situation occurs at a four-way stop. Often a motorist will
approach from my right to arrive the same time, or just before, I do, so
he has the right of way. Many of those motorists won't proceed, perhaps
because they expect me to run the stop sign. Some will enter
"politeness wars" ("You go." "No, you go.") that delay everyone. I
solve this by waving "Go ahead" as I'm coming to a stop, so they know I
won't ride in front of them.

The newest situation occurs at our new roundabout, the first in our
county. Our motorists are not geniuses, and many are not using it
properly. Usually their mistake is to treat the yield signs as stop
signs and delay everyone, but I've seen cars approach far too fast when
I'm in the circle, as if they're not going to yield to me. In that
case, I've held up my hand in a traffic cop's "Stop!" gesture.

A couple of countries I've lived in have a unique method of training
drivers. They post a couple of cops at the round-a-bout and everyone
that does it wrong gets fined.

A couple of days and everyone is merrily going 'round" and no more
problems :-)

But, I'm wondering. What happens if you "hold up your hand like a
traffic cop" and the guy doesn't stop?
--
Cheers,

John B.

On Sun, 07 Dec 2014 16:55:03 -0500, smharding
wrote:

Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 12/6/2014 10:44 PM, Joy Beeson wrote:


You don't signal to tell the operators of other vehicles what you have
done. They don't care.

You don't signal to tell the operators of other vehicles what you are
doing. They can see that for themselves.

You signal to tell the operators of other vehicles what you intend to
do.


There are a few situations where I use signals to tell motorists what
_they_ are supposed to do.

The simplest situation occurs at a four-way stop. Often a motorist will
approach from my right to arrive the same time, or just before, I do, so
he has the right of way. Many of those motorists won't proceed, perhaps
because they expect me to run the stop sign. Some will enter
"politeness wars" ("You go." "No, you go.") that delay everyone. I
solve this by waving "Go ahead" as I'm coming to a stop, so they know I
won't ride in front of them.

The newest situation occurs at our new roundabout, the first in our
county. Our motorists are not geniuses, and many are not using it
properly. Usually their mistake is to treat the yield signs as stop
signs and delay everyone, but I've seen cars approach far too fast when
I'm in the circle, as if they're not going to yield to me. In that
case, I've held up my hand in a traffic cop's "Stop!" gesture.


Here in Massachusetts, it seems traffic circle, or roundabout Yield signs are
interpreted by motorists as "everyone must stop for me".

This is true when I'm in the rotary whether I'm on a bicycle or in my big
honkin', global warming, Dodge Ram 4x4 hemi!

I use hand signals only when I'm turning, just as the operator of a motor
vehicle does (or should).


SMH

Don't they have "turn lights" in America :-?
--
Cheers,

John B.

On Mon, 08 Dec 2014 16:08:42 +0700, John B. Slocomb
wrote:

I use hand signals only when I'm turning, just as the operator of a motor
vehicle does (or should).


SMH

Don't they have "turn lights" in America :-?

Apparently only the most expensive cars have turn signals, and those
people are too important to use them.

On 12/8/2014 4:07 AM, John B. Slocomb wrote:
On Sun, 07 Dec 2014 11:02:42 -0500, Frank Krygowski
wrote:

On 12/6/2014 10:44 PM, Joy Beeson wrote:

You don't signal to tell the operators of other vehicles what you have
done. They don't care.

You don't signal to tell the operators of other vehicles what you are
doing. They can see that for themselves.

You signal to tell the operators of other vehicles what you intend to
do.

There are a few situations where I use signals to tell motorists what
_they_ are supposed to do.

The simplest situation occurs at a four-way stop. Often a motorist will
approach from my right to arrive the same time, or just before, I do, so
he has the right of way. Many of those motorists won't proceed, perhaps
because they expect me to run the stop sign. Some will enter
"politeness wars" ("You go." "No, you go.") that delay everyone. I
solve this by waving "Go ahead" as I'm coming to a stop, so they know I
won't ride in front of them.

The newest situation occurs at our new roundabout, the first in our
county. Our motorists are not geniuses, and many are not using it
properly. Usually their mistake is to treat the yield signs as stop
signs and delay everyone, but I've seen cars approach far too fast when
I'm in the circle, as if they're not going to yield to me. In that
case, I've held up my hand in a traffic cop's "Stop!" gesture.

A couple of countries I've lived in have a unique method of training
drivers. They post a couple of cops at the round-a-bout and everyone
that does it wrong gets fined.

A couple of days and everyone is merrily going 'round" and no more
problems :-)

But, I'm wondering. What happens if you "hold up your hand like a
traffic cop" and the guy doesn't stop?

We'll see if that ever happens, I guess. I haven't had to do this more
than a couple times, and I hope and expect people will get better at
roundabout rules.

But if a motorist failed to yield, I suppose I'd evade by moving onto
the circular center island. It has no curbs. And if there were a
crash, at least it would be a glancing blow, not a 90 degree or head-on
collision.

If I get in a crash there, I'll report it here.

--
- Frank Krygowski

On Mon, 08 Dec 2014 09:48:15 -0500, dgk wrote:

On Mon, 08 Dec 2014 16:08:42 +0700, John B. Slocomb
wrote:

I use hand signals only when I'm turning, just as the operator of a motor
vehicle does (or should).


SMH

Don't they have "turn lights" in America :-?

Apparently only the most expensive cars have turn signals, and those
people are too important to use them.

Truly? In the small 3rd world country I reside in use of "turn lights"
is nearly universal even when only changing lanes on the highway.
--
Cheers,

John B.

On 12/8/2014 7:19 PM, John B. Slocomb wrote:
On Mon, 08 Dec 2014 09:48:15 -0500, dgk wrote:

On Mon, 08 Dec 2014 16:08:42 +0700, John B. Slocomb
wrote:

I use hand signals only when I'm turning, just as the operator of a motor
vehicle does (or should).


SMH

Don't they have "turn lights" in America :-?

Apparently only the most expensive cars have turn signals, and those
people are too important to use them.

Truly? In the small 3rd world country I reside in use of "turn lights"
is nearly universal even when only changing lanes on the highway.

Really, the use of turn signals is amazingly uncommon in the U.S. (I
was going to write "in Ohio," but it occurs to me it's been the same
everywhere.)

It's most frustrating to me when leaving our little neighborhood, trying
to turn out onto the busy five lane road. I'll be waiting for one last
car coming from the left to pass by, so I can scoot out into a brief
clear space. And the car will slow, and slow further; then turn into
the street I'm trying to exit. Some drivers seem to flick the turn
signal on at the same time they begin cranking the wheel to the right.
Many others will never signal at all.

We had friends from Ireland visit us a few years back. The lack of turn
signals caused some astonishment in our friends. "They don't use their
indicators!"

On the plus side, it's not that uncommon for cops to use this as
justification for stopping a known bad guy. Newspaper reports sometimes
say "XXXX was cited for an improper turn, possession of narcotics,
possession of drug paraphernalia..." If these guys were smart enough to
drive really carefully, they'd last longer on the streets.

But as one of my cop friends told me, "They're not Einsteins, Frank."

--
- Frank Krygowski