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Lots of cyclists, lots of lids



 
 
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  #1  
Old April 21st 07, 08:31 PM posted to uk.rec.cycling
Pyromancer
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Posts: 148
Default Lots of cyclists, lots of lids


Last weekend I took a couple of models up into Wharfedale in the van to
do some photoshoots. At one point we drove (carefully!) up the road on
the east side of Bolton Abbey, where we encountered *lots* of cyclists.
Great to see so many people out on bikes, and yes, whenever we met a
bunch coming the other way I pulled over to the side and stopped to let
them past with as much room as possible, got quite a few thank-you nods
for doing that.

Thing is, out of all the cyclists we saw going in either direction, all
bar one solitary individual were fully lidded up. Not a bare head to be
seen bar the one chap in a skull-cap type affair.

At the same time, in recent weeks I've had conversations with two other
cyclists at work, both of whom use lids. I've explained that the lids
increase the risks they face and explained why (risk compensation,
increased head size, rotational injuries, etc) - and the response was
flat disbelief. They believe in their lids and simply will not listen
to any other point of view.

When down in London the week before with another mate who cycles we cam
upon a brand-new shared-use path in Harlow. Great idea he thought. I
explained about shared use being dangerous and cycles being proper
vehicles which belong on the road, and that drivers must learn that
cycles belong on the road. "Yeah right, that's never going to happen is
it" was the response.

All of which makes me wonder if the battle isn't already lost. :-(

--
- DJ Pyromancer, Black Sheep, Leeds. http://www.sheepish.net

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  #2  
Old April 21st 07, 08:45 PM posted to uk.rec.cycling
Ziggy
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Posts: 548
Default Lots of cyclists, lots of lids

On Sat, 21 Apr 2007 20:31:50 +0100, Pyromancer
wrote:


Last weekend I took a couple of models up into Wharfedale in the van to
do some photoshoots. At one point we drove (carefully!) up the road on
the east side of Bolton Abbey, where we encountered *lots* of cyclists.
Great to see so many people out on bikes, and yes, whenever we met a
bunch coming the other way I pulled over to the side and stopped to let
them past with as much room as possible, got quite a few thank-you nods
for doing that.

Thing is, out of all the cyclists we saw going in either direction, all
bar one solitary individual were fully lidded up. Not a bare head to be
seen bar the one chap in a skull-cap type affair.

At the same time, in recent weeks I've had conversations with two other
cyclists at work, both of whom use lids. I've explained that the lids
increase the risks they face and explained why (risk compensation,
increased head size, rotational injuries, etc) - and the response was
flat disbelief. They believe in their lids and simply will not listen
to any other point of view.

When down in London the week before with another mate who cycles we cam
upon a brand-new shared-use path in Harlow. Great idea he thought. I
explained about shared use being dangerous and cycles being proper
vehicles which belong on the road, and that drivers must learn that
cycles belong on the road. "Yeah right, that's never going to happen is
it" was the response.

All of which makes me wonder if the battle isn't already lost. :-(


Slightly depressing post, that.

  #3  
Old April 21st 07, 09:10 PM posted to uk.rec.cycling
peter-potato
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Posts: 49
Default Lots of cyclists, lots of lids


"Pyromancer" wrote in message
...

Last weekend I took a couple of models up into Wharfedale in the van to
do some photoshoots. At one point we drove (carefully!) up the road on
the east side of Bolton Abbey, where we encountered *lots* of cyclists.


Models, what models? I hope they were 2007 models with carbon fibre forks...
:-)
Peter


  #4  
Old April 21st 07, 09:21 PM posted to uk.rec.cycling
Danny Colyer
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Posts: 1,244
Default Lots of cyclists, lots of lids

peter-potato wrote:
Models, what models? I hope they were 2007 models with carbon fibre forks...
:-)


Perhaps Pyromancer will be posting pictures to Simon's HC wiki ;-)

--
Danny Colyer URL:http://www.colyer.plus.com/danny/
Reply address is valid, but that on my website is checked more often
"Daddy, put that down. Daddy, put that down. Daddy, put that down.
Daddy, why did you put that down?" - Charlie Colyer, age 2
  #5  
Old April 21st 07, 10:32 PM posted to uk.rec.cycling
Tony Raven[_2_]
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Posts: 2,162
Default Lots of cyclists, lots of lids

Pyromancer wrote on 21/04/2007 20:31 +0100:

At the same time, in recent weeks I've had conversations with two other
cyclists at work, both of whom use lids. I've explained that the lids
increase the risks they face and explained why (risk compensation,
increased head size, rotational injuries, etc) - and the response was
flat disbelief. They believe in their lids and simply will not listen
to any other point of view.


See the sig.

--
Tony

"You can't convince a believer of anything; for their belief is not
based on evidence, it's based on a deep-seated need to believe."
Carl Sagan
  #6  
Old April 22nd 07, 08:25 AM posted to uk.rec.cycling
Howard
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Posts: 124
Default Lots of cyclists, lots of lids

On Apr 21, 10:32 pm, Tony Raven wrote:
Pyromancer wrote on 21/04/2007 20:31 +0100:



At the same time, in recent weeks I've had conversations with two other
cyclists at work, both of whom use lids. I've explained that the lids
increase the risks they face and explained why (risk compensation,
increased head size, rotational injuries, etc) - and the response was
flat disbelief. They believe in their lids and simply will not listen
to any other point of view.


See the sig.

--
Tony

"You can't convince a believer of anything; for their belief is not
based on evidence, it's based on a deep-seated need to believe."
Carl Sagan


Exactly so. I feel that to many cyclists wearing a helmet is becoming
the equivalent of carrying a rabbit's foot. Whatever the actual
statistical risk of death and serious injury, cyclists constantly
experience potentially dangerous situations, and as the 'Great British
Motorist' is all but out of control, and there are no signs of any
change in attitude or policy which will cause motorists to take
greater care, many cyclists feel a need to gain a sense of control
over the dangers they face. One way they do this is by wearing a
helmet, encouraged by all the misleading pro-helmet propaganda which
gives the impression that an inch of polystyrene foam can 'save lives'
even when a cyclist is run down by a car travelling at high speed or
even a truck.

Another aspect is that in the individualistic, neo-liberal times we
live in everyone is encouraged to 'take responsibility for their own
safety'. Unfortunately this message, in line with the neo-liberal
agenda, completely drowns out any suggestions that people also have
responsibilities for others, especially if they are in charge of
something as potentially lethal as a motor vehicle.


  #7  
Old April 22nd 07, 03:28 PM posted to uk.rec.cycling
[email protected]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 21
Default Lots of cyclists, lots of lids

On 21 Apr, 20:31, Pyromancer
wrote:
Last weekend I took a couple of models up into Wharfedale in the van to
do some photoshoots. At one point we drove (carefully!) up the road on
the east side of Bolton Abbey, where we encountered *lots* of cyclists.
Great to see so many people out on bikes, and yes, whenever we met a
bunch coming the other way I pulled over to the side and stopped to let
them past with as much room as possible, got quite a few thank-you nods
for doing that.

Thing is, out of all the cyclists we saw going in either direction, all
bar one solitary individual were fully lidded up. Not a bare head to be
seen bar the one chap in a skull-cap type affair.

At the same time, in recent weeks I've had conversations with two other
cyclists at work, both of whom use lids. I've explained that the lids
increase the risks they face and explained why (risk compensation,
increased head size, rotational injuries, etc) - and the response was
flat disbelief. They believe in their lids and simply will not listen
to any other point of view.

When down in London the week before with another mate who cycles we cam
upon a brand-new shared-use path in Harlow. Great idea he thought. I
explained about shared use being dangerous and cycles being proper
vehicles which belong on the road, and that drivers must learn that
cycles belong on the road. "Yeah right, that's never going to happen is
it" was the response.

All of which makes me wonder if the battle isn't already lost. :-(


[I've only started cycling seriously after many year's layoff --- so
I'm not too familiar with the arguments and opinions.]

1. I was in Berlin last week; gazillions of cyclists; I didn't see
*one* helmet. Just thinking ... I commuted a great many miles in busy
cities (Portsmouth, Dublin, Belfast) and never thought of a helmet.
When I bought my recent bike, I was sold a helmet, and never thought
of not using it.

2. Over here in Northern Ireland, we have cycle tracks and lanes --
some off road (e.g. a tarmacadamed former railways line), some on the
side of the road, three or four feet wide, sort of like a hard
shoulder. Fine? No, not so fine: (a) broken glass, and, because cars
stay out of the cycle lane, it doesn't get 'swept'; (b) however, one
feels obliged to attempt to use the cycle lane. Plus, anywhere near my
city, the off-road cycle tracks are more like cider-drinking tracks --
with the attendant broken glass.

I don't commute by bike now, but when I did I used to reckon that the
safest place was in the middle of the lane and that hugging the
footpath was relatively dangerous.

Best regards,

Jon C.

  #8  
Old April 22nd 07, 03:29 PM posted to uk.rec.cycling
[email protected]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 21
Default Lots of cyclists, lots of lids

On 21 Apr, 20:31, Pyromancer
wrote:
Last weekend I took a couple of models up into Wharfedale in the van to
do some photoshoots. At one point we drove (carefully!) up the road on
the east side of Bolton Abbey, where we encountered *lots* of cyclists.
Great to see so many people out on bikes, and yes, whenever we met a
bunch coming the other way I pulled over to the side and stopped to let
them past with as much room as possible, got quite a few thank-you nods
for doing that.

Thing is, out of all the cyclists we saw going in either direction, all
bar one solitary individual were fully lidded up. Not a bare head to be
seen bar the one chap in a skull-cap type affair.

At the same time, in recent weeks I've had conversations with two other
cyclists at work, both of whom use lids. I've explained that the lids
increase the risks they face and explained why (risk compensation,
increased head size, rotational injuries, etc) - and the response was
flat disbelief. They believe in their lids and simply will not listen
to any other point of view.

When down in London the week before with another mate who cycles we cam
upon a brand-new shared-use path in Harlow. Great idea he thought. I
explained about shared use being dangerous and cycles being proper
vehicles which belong on the road, and that drivers must learn that
cycles belong on the road. "Yeah right, that's never going to happen is
it" was the response.

All of which makes me wonder if the battle isn't already lost. :-(

[...]

[I've only started cycling seriously after many year's layoff --- so
I'm not too familiar with the arguments and opinions.]

1. I was in Berlin last week; gazillions of cyclists; I didn't see
*one* helmet. Just thinking ... I commuted a great many miles in busy
cities (Portsmouth, Dublin, Belfast) and never thought of a helmet.
When I bought my recent bike, I was sold a helmet, and never thought
of not using it.

2. Over here in Northern Ireland, we have cycle tracks and lanes --
some off road (e.g. a tarmacadamed former railways line), some on the
side of the road, three or four feet wide, sort of like a hard
shoulder. Fine? No, not so fine: (a) broken glass, and, because cars
stay out of the cycle lane, it doesn't get 'swept'; (b) however, one
feels obliged to attempt to use the cycle lane. Plus, anywhere near my
city, the off-road cycle tracks are more like cider-drinking tracks --
with the attendant broken glass.

I don't commute by bike now, but when I did I used to reckon that the
safest place was in the middle of the lane and that hugging the
footpath was relatively dangerous.

Best regards,

Jon C.

  #9  
Old April 22nd 07, 03:40 PM posted to uk.rec.cycling
Peter Clinch
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Posts: 4,852
Default Lots of cyclists, lots of lids

Scrumpy Joe wrote:
Howard wrote:

snipped
Another aspect is that in the individualistic, neo-liberal times we
live in everyone is encouraged to 'take responsibility for their own
safety'.


snipped

But we are not encouraged are we? If there was a clear case for taking
responsibility for our own safety we wouldn't have H&S risk assessments
banning things for the most trivial of reasons.


FSVO "encouragement". The Powers That Be and/or Society and/or the
Meejah decide what's right and you're pilloried if you don't do it,
which many people find quite, ummm, "encouraging" in setting their
behaviour as free individuals... ;-/

Pete.
--
Peter Clinch Medical Physics IT Officer
Tel 44 1382 660111 ext. 33637 Univ. of Dundee, Ninewells Hospital
Fax 44 1382 640177 Dundee DD1 9SY Scotland UK
net http://www.dundee.ac.uk/~pjclinch/
  #10  
Old April 22nd 07, 04:06 PM posted to uk.rec.cycling
David Hansen
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Posts: 2,206
Default Lots of cyclists, lots of lids

On Sat, 21 Apr 2007 20:31:50 +0100 someone who may be Pyromancer
wrote this:-

They believe in their lids and simply will not listen
to any other point of view.


Convincing such believers is likely to be a long task.


--
David Hansen, Edinburgh
I will *always* explain revoked encryption keys, unless RIP prevents me
http://www.opsi.gov.uk/acts/acts2000/00023--e.htm#54
 




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