AP on demise of an elite police unit in Portland, Oregon.

On 3/11/2021 2:17 PM, AMuzi wrote:
On 3/11/2021 11:43 AM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 3/11/2021 11:56 AM, Tom Kunich wrote:
On Thursday, March 11, 2021 at 7:53:22 AM UTC-8, Frank
Krygowski wrote:
On 3/11/2021 10:27 AM, jbeattie wrote:
On Wednesday, March 10, 2021 at 11:35:02 PM UTC-8, Andre
Jute wrote:
On Thursday, March 11, 2021 at 12:49:03 AM UTC, AMuzi
wrote:
On 3/10/2021 6:38 PM, jbeattie wrote:
On Wednesday, March 10, 2021 at 2:18:17 PM UTC-8,
AMuzi wrote:
On 3/10/2021 4:08 PM, Andre Jute wrote:
On Wednesday, March 10, 2021 at 6:50:21 PM UTC,
AMuzi wrote:
On 3/10/2021 12:35 PM, Andre Jute wrote:
Lefties have no loyalty, but I'm not surprised
Jay wants to make a runner for some place better
run than Portland:

https://townhall.com/tipsheet/guyben...force-n2585894



Portland had as many murders in 2020 as the
entire country of Ireland will have in over
thirty years. Portland in three years and a bit
will have as many did of gunshot and explosive
wounds as Northern Ireland had in thirty years of
terrorist violence and reprisals. That's a pretty
elevated level of violence in Portland, which Jay
has held up to us as "mostly peaceful".

If my country were as "peaceful" as the city of
Portland, the police commissioner would long
since have kissed his job goodbye, and the
government would have fallen to a no-confidence
vote after about three months.

Andre Jute
Just being reasonable

Ireland has half the population of Chicago GMA
(more than
City of Chicago but not that much more). Portland
GMA is
about 1/2 of Ireland.
.
Okay, like for like. On a base of 100K of the
population, how many would be murdered in Ireland
and in Portland?
.
In Ireland per 100K population, 0.87 would be
murdered (1918).
https://www.macrotrends.net/countrie...-homicide-rate


.
In Portland per 100K population, 4 would be
murdered. Portland is safer than only 2 percent of
US cities.
https://www.neighborhoodscout.com/or...me#description

.
The usual googlebugs can bus us more up to date
numbers.
.
Not attacking or defending anyone here but those
things
matter. Density probably as well.
.
Density for sure. You'd be amazed how fast rats
turn viciously paranoid if they're crowded.

Personally, I think the number of firearms in
circulation matters as well, but we can argue that
case another day. Right now I'm arguing Donkey
Party incompetence and irresponsibility.
.
Andre Jute
It's a slam-dunk case.

You could argue it, but to be fair you'd need a
not-dixiecrat-controlled major US city for comparison.
--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org/
Open every day since 1 April, 1971

Historically, Tulsa and Oklahoma City had a violent
crime rates nearly twice that of Portland. This is a
bad year, obviously, and I haven't compared current
statistics.

I have (counting) five shooting cases on my desk --
all since the pandemic, four in strip club parking
lots. I represent an insurer that writes strip clubs.
it used to be they just fought, but now its guns.

Like I said, this year is an outlier, and we've had
Democrat-ish (its non-partisan) mayors for the last
40 years.

-- Jay Beattie.





That's a very tough situation for a business owner:
https://apnews.com/4c7a568bfa07c98b90c0292c7e592923
(just down the road from here)

Similarly, an immigrant of my acquaintance, with his
extended family, literally built a restaurant (brick;
took
almost two years) and successful business. After 20 years
of paying taxes and employing people, the permits were
yanked after a couple of thugs shot up the parking lot
after
hours one night.

I expect a strip club manager to keep the customers'
hands
off the dancers but not to search every car coming
into the
parking lot, frisk the people inside or interrogate them.
That's an unreasonable standard.
--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org/
Open every day since 1 April, 1971
That's like stoking vigilantism and then decrying it
because the politicians don't have the balls to keep a
proper police force recruited, staffed, supplied and
motivated. What a shower of dialectical fools. -- AJ

These strip club shootings are usually intimate affairs
with no wind-up or little wind-up, and the reason for
the shooting often is not obvious. Having a "proper
police force" with balls (!) would do nothing more than
speed apprehension of the shooter. It's not the Sharks
and the Jets with Russ Tamblyn snapping his fingers and
officer Krupke telling the boys to break it up. One
shooting was inside a closed strip club with two young
men doing maintenance and remodeling, and one shot the
other. They were friends.

Increased police presence may prevent certain shootings,
but not others. I've watched the video, and it is often
a WTF moment where you cannot tell why on earth one guy
is shooting the other guy. In one case in particular, a
group of guys in a parking lot all look like friends --
and then shots. There is a usually a back-story.
Right. It used to be fists. Now it's guns.

So what we need is for more people to have guns?? Sheesh.

--
- Frank Krygowski
Well, as is usual, you're Franky-on-the-spot to tell
others how they should live.


So you're defending shooting someone who offends you in a
strip club parking lot?

Wow.


No, that's a crime and no one here suggests it.

Tom seemed to imply some approval for shooting. What else could he have
meant?

Then again taking second place is pretty ugly:

https://abc7chicago.com/would-be-car...-loop/5272059/


"The shooting happened at around 3:15 a.m. Friday on Ida B. Wells and
Clark Street after a man in a Volkswagen rear-ended a BMW.

According to police, the driver of the BMW got out to inspect the damage
and when he went back to get his cell phone, the Volkswagen driver
approached with a handgun, demanded his keys and pushed him into the
vehicle.

Both men were inside the vehicle when police said the 41-year-old BMW
driver retrieved his handgun and shot the 22-year-old man in the head."

Yes, those kinds of incidents seem to be a consequence of having guns
everywhere. They seem to be much more rare in most economically advanced
countries - that is, countries with rational gun control.

--
- Frank Krygowski

On 3/11/2021 7:54 PM, John B. wrote:
On Thu, 11 Mar 2021 10:53:17 -0500, Frank Krygowski
wrote:

On 3/11/2021 10:27 AM, jbeattie wrote:
On Wednesday, March 10, 2021 at 11:35:02 PM UTC-8, Andre Jute wrote:
On Thursday, March 11, 2021 at 12:49:03 AM UTC, AMuzi wrote:
On 3/10/2021 6:38 PM, jbeattie wrote:
On Wednesday, March 10, 2021 at 2:18:17 PM UTC-8, AMuzi wrote:
On 3/10/2021 4:08 PM, Andre Jute wrote:
On Wednesday, March 10, 2021 at 6:50:21 PM UTC, AMuzi wrote:
On 3/10/2021 12:35 PM, Andre Jute wrote:
Lefties have no loyalty, but I'm not surprised Jay wants to make a runner for some place better run than Portland:

https://townhall.com/tipsheet/guyben...force-n2585894

Portland had as many murders in 2020 as the entire country of Ireland will have in over thirty years. Portland in three years and a bit will have as many did of gunshot and explosive wounds as Northern Ireland had in thirty years of terrorist violence and reprisals. That's a pretty elevated level of violence in Portland, which Jay has held up to us as "mostly peaceful".

If my country were as "peaceful" as the city of Portland, the police commissioner would long since have kissed his job goodbye, and the government would have fallen to a no-confidence vote after about three months.

Andre Jute
Just being reasonable

Ireland has half the population of Chicago GMA (more than
City of Chicago but not that much more). Portland GMA is
about 1/2 of Ireland.
.
Okay, like for like. On a base of 100K of the population, how many would be murdered in Ireland and in Portland?
.
In Ireland per 100K population, 0.87 would be murdered (1918). https://www.macrotrends.net/countrie...-homicide-rate
.
In Portland per 100K population, 4 would be murdered. Portland is safer than only 2 percent of US cities.
https://www.neighborhoodscout.com/or...me#description
.
The usual googlebugs can bus us more up to date numbers.
.
Not attacking or defending anyone here but those things
matter. Density probably as well.
.
Density for sure. You'd be amazed how fast rats turn viciously paranoid if they're crowded.

Personally, I think the number of firearms in circulation matters as well, but we can argue that case another day. Right now I'm arguing Donkey Party incompetence and irresponsibility.
.
Andre Jute
It's a slam-dunk case.

You could argue it, but to be fair you'd need a
not-dixiecrat-controlled major US city for comparison.
--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org/
Open every day since 1 April, 1971

Historically, Tulsa and Oklahoma City had a violent crime rates nearly twice that of Portland. This is a bad year, obviously, and I haven't compared current statistics.

I have (counting) five shooting cases on my desk -- all since the pandemic, four in strip club parking lots. I represent an insurer that writes strip clubs. it used to be they just fought, but now its guns.

Like I said, this year is an outlier, and we've had Democrat-ish (its non-partisan) mayors for the last 40 years.

-- Jay Beattie.





That's a very tough situation for a business owner:
https://apnews.com/4c7a568bfa07c98b90c0292c7e592923
(just down the road from here)

Similarly, an immigrant of my acquaintance, with his
extended family, literally built a restaurant (brick; took
almost two years) and successful business. After 20 years
of paying taxes and employing people, the permits were
yanked after a couple of thugs shot up the parking lot after
hours one night.

I expect a strip club manager to keep the customers' hands
off the dancers but not to search every car coming into the
parking lot, frisk the people inside or interrogate them.
That's an unreasonable standard.
--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org/
Open every day since 1 April, 1971
That's like stoking vigilantism and then decrying it because the politicians don't have the balls to keep a proper police force recruited, staffed, supplied and motivated. What a shower of dialectical fools. -- AJ

These strip club shootings are usually intimate affairs with no wind-up or little wind-up, and the reason for the shooting often is not obvious. Having a "proper police force" with balls (!) would do nothing more than speed apprehension of the shooter. It's not the Sharks and the Jets with Russ Tamblyn snapping his fingers and officer Krupke telling the boys to break it up. One shooting was inside a closed strip club with two young men doing maintenance and remodeling, and one shot the other. They were friends.

Increased police presence may prevent certain shootings, but not others. I've watched the video, and it is often a WTF moment where you cannot tell why on earth one guy is shooting the other guy. In one case in particular, a group of guys in a parking lot all look like friends -- and then shots. There is a usually a back-story.

Right. It used to be fists. Now it's guns.

So what we need is for more people to have guns?? Sheesh.

Well, from a purely statistical point of view global warming is simply
a matter of population growth - more people more contaminates - so
essentially a couple of blokes shooting each other might be viewed as
their contribution to the lessoning of the world's CO2 overload :-)

Or perhaps, harking back to ancient times - The O.K. Corral, etc. -
they are lowlifes so we don't need them. Good riddance!

I'll note that the "ancient times" of the O.K. Corral had plenty of gun
control, often stricter than today.

https://www.smithsonianmag.com/histo...est-180968013/

Modern day wannabe cowboys have forgotten that.


--
- Frank Krygowski

On Thursday, March 11, 2021 at 10:53:48 p.m. UTC-5, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 3/11/2021 7:54 PM, John B. wrote:
On Thu, 11 Mar 2021 10:53:17 -0500, Frank Krygowski
wrote:

On 3/11/2021 10:27 AM, jbeattie wrote:
On Wednesday, March 10, 2021 at 11:35:02 PM UTC-8, Andre Jute wrote:
On Thursday, March 11, 2021 at 12:49:03 AM UTC, AMuzi wrote:
On 3/10/2021 6:38 PM, jbeattie wrote:
On Wednesday, March 10, 2021 at 2:18:17 PM UTC-8, AMuzi wrote:
On 3/10/2021 4:08 PM, Andre Jute wrote:
On Wednesday, March 10, 2021 at 6:50:21 PM UTC, AMuzi wrote:
On 3/10/2021 12:35 PM, Andre Jute wrote:
Lefties have no loyalty, but I'm not surprised Jay wants to make a runner for some place better run than Portland:

https://townhall.com/tipsheet/guyben...force-n2585894

Portland had as many murders in 2020 as the entire country of Ireland will have in over thirty years. Portland in three years and a bit will have as many did of gunshot and explosive wounds as Northern Ireland had in thirty years of terrorist violence and reprisals. That's a pretty elevated level of violence in Portland, which Jay has held up to us as "mostly peaceful".

If my country were as "peaceful" as the city of Portland, the police commissioner would long since have kissed his job goodbye, and the government would have fallen to a no-confidence vote after about three months.

Andre Jute
Just being reasonable

Ireland has half the population of Chicago GMA (more than
City of Chicago but not that much more). Portland GMA is
about 1/2 of Ireland.
.
Okay, like for like. On a base of 100K of the population, how many would be murdered in Ireland and in Portland?
.
In Ireland per 100K population, 0.87 would be murdered (1918). https://www.macrotrends.net/countrie...-homicide-rate
.
In Portland per 100K population, 4 would be murdered. Portland is safer than only 2 percent of US cities.
https://www.neighborhoodscout.com/or...me#description
.
The usual googlebugs can bus us more up to date numbers.
.
Not attacking or defending anyone here but those things
matter. Density probably as well.
.
Density for sure. You'd be amazed how fast rats turn viciously paranoid if they're crowded.

Personally, I think the number of firearms in circulation matters as well, but we can argue that case another day. Right now I'm arguing Donkey Party incompetence and irresponsibility.
.
Andre Jute
It's a slam-dunk case.

You could argue it, but to be fair you'd need a
not-dixiecrat-controlled major US city for comparison.
--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org/
Open every day since 1 April, 1971

Historically, Tulsa and Oklahoma City had a violent crime rates nearly twice that of Portland. This is a bad year, obviously, and I haven't compared current statistics.

I have (counting) five shooting cases on my desk -- all since the pandemic, four in strip club parking lots. I represent an insurer that writes strip clubs. it used to be they just fought, but now its guns.

Like I said, this year is an outlier, and we've had Democrat-ish (its non-partisan) mayors for the last 40 years.

-- Jay Beattie.





That's a very tough situation for a business owner:
https://apnews.com/4c7a568bfa07c98b90c0292c7e592923
(just down the road from here)

Similarly, an immigrant of my acquaintance, with his
extended family, literally built a restaurant (brick; took
almost two years) and successful business. After 20 years
of paying taxes and employing people, the permits were
yanked after a couple of thugs shot up the parking lot after
hours one night.

I expect a strip club manager to keep the customers' hands
off the dancers but not to search every car coming into the
parking lot, frisk the people inside or interrogate them.
That's an unreasonable standard.
--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org/
Open every day since 1 April, 1971
That's like stoking vigilantism and then decrying it because the politicians don't have the balls to keep a proper police force recruited, staffed, supplied and motivated. What a shower of dialectical fools. -- AJ

These strip club shootings are usually intimate affairs with no wind-up or little wind-up, and the reason for the shooting often is not obvious. Having a "proper police force" with balls (!) would do nothing more than speed apprehension of the shooter. It's not the Sharks and the Jets with Russ Tamblyn snapping his fingers and officer Krupke telling the boys to break it up. One shooting was inside a closed strip club with two young men doing maintenance and remodeling, and one shot the other. They were friends.

Increased police presence may prevent certain shootings, but not others. I've watched the video, and it is often a WTF moment where you cannot tell why on earth one guy is shooting the other guy. In one case in particular, a group of guys in a parking lot all look like friends -- and then shots. There is a usually a back-story.

Right. It used to be fists. Now it's guns.

So what we need is for more people to have guns?? Sheesh.

Well, from a purely statistical point of view global warming is simply
a matter of population growth - more people more contaminates - so
essentially a couple of blokes shooting each other might be viewed as
their contribution to the lessoning of the world's CO2 overload :-)

Or perhaps, harking back to ancient times - The O.K. Corral, etc. -
they are lowlifes so we don't need them. Good riddance!
I'll note that the "ancient times" of the O.K. Corral had plenty of gun
control, often stricter than today.

https://www.smithsonianmag.com/histo...est-180968013/

Modern day wannabe cowboys have forgotten that.


--
- Frank Krygowski

Wasn't a demand that the Clantons and cowboys (outlaws) surrender their guns one of the main causes of the Gunfight at the OK Corral in the first place?

From Wikipedia:
"According to the Earps' version of events, the fight was in self-defense because the Cowboys, armed in violation of local ordinance, defied a lawful order to hand over their weapons and drew their pistols instead. The Cowboys maintained that they raised their hands, offered no resistance, and were shot in cold blood by the Earps. Sorting out who was telling the truth was difficult then and remains so to this day.[13]"

Cheers

On Thu, 11 Mar 2021 22:53:45 -0500, Frank Krygowski
wrote:

On 3/11/2021 7:54 PM, John B. wrote:
On Thu, 11 Mar 2021 10:53:17 -0500, Frank Krygowski
wrote:

On 3/11/2021 10:27 AM, jbeattie wrote:
On Wednesday, March 10, 2021 at 11:35:02 PM UTC-8, Andre Jute wrote:
On Thursday, March 11, 2021 at 12:49:03 AM UTC, AMuzi wrote:
On 3/10/2021 6:38 PM, jbeattie wrote:
On Wednesday, March 10, 2021 at 2:18:17 PM UTC-8, AMuzi wrote:
On 3/10/2021 4:08 PM, Andre Jute wrote:
On Wednesday, March 10, 2021 at 6:50:21 PM UTC, AMuzi wrote:
On 3/10/2021 12:35 PM, Andre Jute wrote:
Lefties have no loyalty, but I'm not surprised Jay wants to make a runner for some place better run than Portland:

https://townhall.com/tipsheet/guyben...force-n2585894

Portland had as many murders in 2020 as the entire country of Ireland will have in over thirty years. Portland in three years and a bit will have as many did of gunshot and explosive wounds as Northern Ireland had in thirty years of terrorist violence and reprisals. That's a pretty elevated level of violence in Portland, which Jay has held up to us as "mostly peaceful".

If my country were as "peaceful" as the city of Portland, the police commissioner would long since have kissed his job goodbye, and the government would have fallen to a no-confidence vote after about three months.

Andre Jute
Just being reasonable

Ireland has half the population of Chicago GMA (more than
City of Chicago but not that much more). Portland GMA is
about 1/2 of Ireland.
.
Okay, like for like. On a base of 100K of the population, how many would be murdered in Ireland and in Portland?
.
In Ireland per 100K population, 0.87 would be murdered (1918). https://www.macrotrends.net/countrie...-homicide-rate
.
In Portland per 100K population, 4 would be murdered. Portland is safer than only 2 percent of US cities.
https://www.neighborhoodscout.com/or...me#description
.
The usual googlebugs can bus us more up to date numbers.
.
Not attacking or defending anyone here but those things
matter. Density probably as well.
.
Density for sure. You'd be amazed how fast rats turn viciously paranoid if they're crowded.

Personally, I think the number of firearms in circulation matters as well, but we can argue that case another day. Right now I'm arguing Donkey Party incompetence and irresponsibility.
.
Andre Jute
It's a slam-dunk case.

You could argue it, but to be fair you'd need a
not-dixiecrat-controlled major US city for comparison.
--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org/
Open every day since 1 April, 1971

Historically, Tulsa and Oklahoma City had a violent crime rates nearly twice that of Portland. This is a bad year, obviously, and I haven't compared current statistics.

I have (counting) five shooting cases on my desk -- all since the pandemic, four in strip club parking lots. I represent an insurer that writes strip clubs. it used to be they just fought, but now its guns.

Like I said, this year is an outlier, and we've had Democrat-ish (its non-partisan) mayors for the last 40 years.

-- Jay Beattie.





That's a very tough situation for a business owner:
https://apnews.com/4c7a568bfa07c98b90c0292c7e592923
(just down the road from here)

Similarly, an immigrant of my acquaintance, with his
extended family, literally built a restaurant (brick; took
almost two years) and successful business. After 20 years
of paying taxes and employing people, the permits were
yanked after a couple of thugs shot up the parking lot after
hours one night.

I expect a strip club manager to keep the customers' hands
off the dancers but not to search every car coming into the
parking lot, frisk the people inside or interrogate them.
That's an unreasonable standard.
--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org/
Open every day since 1 April, 1971
That's like stoking vigilantism and then decrying it because the politicians don't have the balls to keep a proper police force recruited, staffed, supplied and motivated. What a shower of dialectical fools. -- AJ

These strip club shootings are usually intimate affairs with no wind-up or little wind-up, and the reason for the shooting often is not obvious. Having a "proper police force" with balls (!) would do nothing more than speed apprehension of the shooter. It's not the Sharks and the Jets with Russ Tamblyn snapping his fingers and officer Krupke telling the boys to break it up. One shooting was inside a closed strip club with two young men doing maintenance and remodeling, and one shot the other. They were friends.

Increased police presence may prevent certain shootings, but not others. I've watched the video, and it is often a WTF moment where you cannot tell why on earth one guy is shooting the other guy. In one case in particular, a group of guys in a parking lot all look like friends -- and then shots. There is a usually a back-story.

Right. It used to be fists. Now it's guns.

So what we need is for more people to have guns?? Sheesh.

Well, from a purely statistical point of view global warming is simply
a matter of population growth - more people more contaminates - so
essentially a couple of blokes shooting each other might be viewed as
their contribution to the lessoning of the world's CO2 overload :-)

Or perhaps, harking back to ancient times - The O.K. Corral, etc. -
they are lowlifes so we don't need them. Good riddance!

I'll note that the "ancient times" of the O.K. Corral had plenty of gun
control, often stricter than today.

https://www.smithsonianmag.com/histo...est-180968013/

Modern day wannabe cowboys have forgotten that.

Gun control about where you could go armed not whether you could own a
weapon(s). In fact the O.K. Corral fight (which wasn't at the corral
:-) occurred because the "Cowboys" were carrying guns in town.
--
Cheers,

John B.

On Thu, 11 Mar 2021 20:10:08 -0800 (PST), Sir Ridesalot
wrote:

On Thursday, March 11, 2021 at 10:53:48 p.m. UTC-5, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 3/11/2021 7:54 PM, John B. wrote:
On Thu, 11 Mar 2021 10:53:17 -0500, Frank Krygowski
wrote:

On 3/11/2021 10:27 AM, jbeattie wrote:
On Wednesday, March 10, 2021 at 11:35:02 PM UTC-8, Andre Jute wrote:
On Thursday, March 11, 2021 at 12:49:03 AM UTC, AMuzi wrote:
On 3/10/2021 6:38 PM, jbeattie wrote:
On Wednesday, March 10, 2021 at 2:18:17 PM UTC-8, AMuzi wrote:
On 3/10/2021 4:08 PM, Andre Jute wrote:
On Wednesday, March 10, 2021 at 6:50:21 PM UTC, AMuzi wrote:
On 3/10/2021 12:35 PM, Andre Jute wrote:
Lefties have no loyalty, but I'm not surprised Jay wants to make a runner for some place better run than Portland:

https://townhall.com/tipsheet/guyben...force-n2585894

Portland had as many murders in 2020 as the entire country of Ireland will have in over thirty years. Portland in three years and a bit will have as many did of gunshot and explosive wounds as Northern Ireland had in thirty years of terrorist violence and reprisals. That's a pretty elevated level of violence in Portland, which Jay has held up to us as "mostly peaceful".

If my country were as "peaceful" as the city of Portland, the police commissioner would long since have kissed his job goodbye, and the government would have fallen to a no-confidence vote after about three months.

Andre Jute
Just being reasonable

Ireland has half the population of Chicago GMA (more than
City of Chicago but not that much more). Portland GMA is
about 1/2 of Ireland.
.
Okay, like for like. On a base of 100K of the population, how many would be murdered in Ireland and in Portland?
.
In Ireland per 100K population, 0.87 would be murdered (1918). https://www.macrotrends.net/countrie...-homicide-rate
.
In Portland per 100K population, 4 would be murdered. Portland is safer than only 2 percent of US cities.
https://www.neighborhoodscout.com/or...me#description
.
The usual googlebugs can bus us more up to date numbers.
.
Not attacking or defending anyone here but those things
matter. Density probably as well.
.
Density for sure. You'd be amazed how fast rats turn viciously paranoid if they're crowded.

Personally, I think the number of firearms in circulation matters as well, but we can argue that case another day. Right now I'm arguing Donkey Party incompetence and irresponsibility.
.
Andre Jute
It's a slam-dunk case.

You could argue it, but to be fair you'd need a
not-dixiecrat-controlled major US city for comparison.
--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org/
Open every day since 1 April, 1971

Historically, Tulsa and Oklahoma City had a violent crime rates nearly twice that of Portland. This is a bad year, obviously, and I haven't compared current statistics.

I have (counting) five shooting cases on my desk -- all since the pandemic, four in strip club parking lots. I represent an insurer that writes strip clubs. it used to be they just fought, but now its guns.

Like I said, this year is an outlier, and we've had Democrat-ish (its non-partisan) mayors for the last 40 years.

-- Jay Beattie.





That's a very tough situation for a business owner:
https://apnews.com/4c7a568bfa07c98b90c0292c7e592923
(just down the road from here)

Similarly, an immigrant of my acquaintance, with his
extended family, literally built a restaurant (brick; took
almost two years) and successful business. After 20 years
of paying taxes and employing people, the permits were
yanked after a couple of thugs shot up the parking lot after
hours one night.

I expect a strip club manager to keep the customers' hands
off the dancers but not to search every car coming into the
parking lot, frisk the people inside or interrogate them.
That's an unreasonable standard.
--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org/
Open every day since 1 April, 1971
That's like stoking vigilantism and then decrying it because the politicians don't have the balls to keep a proper police force recruited, staffed, supplied and motivated. What a shower of dialectical fools. -- AJ

These strip club shootings are usually intimate affairs with no wind-up or little wind-up, and the reason for the shooting often is not obvious. Having a "proper police force" with balls (!) would do nothing more than speed apprehension of the shooter. It's not the Sharks and the Jets with Russ Tamblyn snapping his fingers and officer Krupke telling the boys to break it up. One shooting was inside a closed strip club with two young men doing maintenance and remodeling, and one shot the other. They were friends.

Increased police presence may prevent certain shootings, but not others. I've watched the video, and it is often a WTF moment where you cannot tell why on earth one guy is shooting the other guy. In one case in particular, a group of guys in a parking lot all look like friends -- and then shots. There is a usually a back-story.

Right. It used to be fists. Now it's guns.

So what we need is for more people to have guns?? Sheesh.

Well, from a purely statistical point of view global warming is simply
a matter of population growth - more people more contaminates - so
essentially a couple of blokes shooting each other might be viewed as
their contribution to the lessoning of the world's CO2 overload :-)

Or perhaps, harking back to ancient times - The O.K. Corral, etc. -
they are lowlifes so we don't need them. Good riddance!
I'll note that the "ancient times" of the O.K. Corral had plenty of gun
control, often stricter than today.

https://www.smithsonianmag.com/histo...est-180968013/

Modern day wannabe cowboys have forgotten that.


--
- Frank Krygowski

Wasn't a demand that the Clantons and cowboys (outlaws) surrender their guns one of the main causes of the Gunfight at the OK Corral in the first place?

From Wikipedia:
"According to the Earps' version of events, the fight was in self-defense because the Cowboys, armed in violation of local ordinance, defied a lawful order to hand over their weapons and drew their pistols instead. The Cowboys maintained that they raised their hands, offered no resistance, and were shot in cold blood by the Earps. Sorting out who was telling the truth was difficult then and remains so to this day.[13]"

Cheers

There was an official investigation made into the O.K. Corral fight at
the time and I read it somewhere on the Web although I can't find it
now. It was basically a recital by Wyatt Earp with added confirmations
by others and generally (which seems logical) placed the blame solely
on the shoulders of the "Cowboys".

The following is not the actual report but does discuss it in detail.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/O.K._C..._and_aftermath
--
Cheers,

John B.

I prefer the black and white version of the OK Corral seen at the local Bio-Scope, inevitably called the Gaiety, at Saturday matinees back when I was a boy. None of this nancy-boy bull**** about Miranda rights for bad guys, and the director had the good sense to put the Donkey Party voters in black hats so the boys and girls in the front row could know who to pop their gum at.

Andre Jute
Soon there won't be any culture left to criticise, only dull CentraCom Bidens* from the Bunker.

* A "Biden" is a garbled message from an ancient Kleptocrat. By 2024 many people couldn't even remember any other kind, and were preparing to vote for Sleepy Joe again, a process the Outlaw Humorist Andre Jute labelled "the bushintonization of Amurrica".

On 3/11/2021 11:10 PM, Sir Ridesalot wrote:
On Thursday, March 11, 2021 at 10:53:48 p.m. UTC-5, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 3/11/2021 7:54 PM, John B. wrote:
On Thu, 11 Mar 2021 10:53:17 -0500, Frank Krygowski
wrote:

On 3/11/2021 10:27 AM, jbeattie wrote:
On Wednesday, March 10, 2021 at 11:35:02 PM UTC-8, Andre Jute wrote:
On Thursday, March 11, 2021 at 12:49:03 AM UTC, AMuzi wrote:
On 3/10/2021 6:38 PM, jbeattie wrote:
On Wednesday, March 10, 2021 at 2:18:17 PM UTC-8, AMuzi wrote:
On 3/10/2021 4:08 PM, Andre Jute wrote:
On Wednesday, March 10, 2021 at 6:50:21 PM UTC, AMuzi wrote:
On 3/10/2021 12:35 PM, Andre Jute wrote:
Lefties have no loyalty, but I'm not surprised Jay wants to make a runner for some place better run than Portland:

https://townhall.com/tipsheet/guyben...force-n2585894

Portland had as many murders in 2020 as the entire country of Ireland will have in over thirty years. Portland in three years and a bit will have as many did of gunshot and explosive wounds as Northern Ireland had in thirty years of terrorist violence and reprisals. That's a pretty elevated level of violence in Portland, which Jay has held up to us as "mostly peaceful".

If my country were as "peaceful" as the city of Portland, the police commissioner would long since have kissed his job goodbye, and the government would have fallen to a no-confidence vote after about three months.

Andre Jute
Just being reasonable

Ireland has half the population of Chicago GMA (more than
City of Chicago but not that much more). Portland GMA is
about 1/2 of Ireland.
.
Okay, like for like. On a base of 100K of the population, how many would be murdered in Ireland and in Portland?
.
In Ireland per 100K population, 0.87 would be murdered (1918). https://www.macrotrends.net/countrie...-homicide-rate
.
In Portland per 100K population, 4 would be murdered. Portland is safer than only 2 percent of US cities.
https://www.neighborhoodscout.com/or...me#description
.
The usual googlebugs can bus us more up to date numbers.
.
Not attacking or defending anyone here but those things
matter. Density probably as well.
.
Density for sure. You'd be amazed how fast rats turn viciously paranoid if they're crowded.

Personally, I think the number of firearms in circulation matters as well, but we can argue that case another day. Right now I'm arguing Donkey Party incompetence and irresponsibility.
.
Andre Jute
It's a slam-dunk case.

You could argue it, but to be fair you'd need a
not-dixiecrat-controlled major US city for comparison.
--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org/
Open every day since 1 April, 1971

Historically, Tulsa and Oklahoma City had a violent crime rates nearly twice that of Portland. This is a bad year, obviously, and I haven't compared current statistics.

I have (counting) five shooting cases on my desk -- all since the pandemic, four in strip club parking lots. I represent an insurer that writes strip clubs. it used to be they just fought, but now its guns.

Like I said, this year is an outlier, and we've had Democrat-ish (its non-partisan) mayors for the last 40 years.

-- Jay Beattie.





That's a very tough situation for a business owner:
https://apnews.com/4c7a568bfa07c98b90c0292c7e592923
(just down the road from here)

Similarly, an immigrant of my acquaintance, with his
extended family, literally built a restaurant (brick; took
almost two years) and successful business. After 20 years
of paying taxes and employing people, the permits were
yanked after a couple of thugs shot up the parking lot after
hours one night.

I expect a strip club manager to keep the customers' hands
off the dancers but not to search every car coming into the
parking lot, frisk the people inside or interrogate them.
That's an unreasonable standard.
--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org/
Open every day since 1 April, 1971
That's like stoking vigilantism and then decrying it because the politicians don't have the balls to keep a proper police force recruited, staffed, supplied and motivated. What a shower of dialectical fools. -- AJ

These strip club shootings are usually intimate affairs with no wind-up or little wind-up, and the reason for the shooting often is not obvious. Having a "proper police force" with balls (!) would do nothing more than speed apprehension of the shooter. It's not the Sharks and the Jets with Russ Tamblyn snapping his fingers and officer Krupke telling the boys to break it up. One shooting was inside a closed strip club with two young men doing maintenance and remodeling, and one shot the other. They were friends.

Increased police presence may prevent certain shootings, but not others. I've watched the video, and it is often a WTF moment where you cannot tell why on earth one guy is shooting the other guy. In one case in particular, a group of guys in a parking lot all look like friends -- and then shots. There is a usually a back-story.

Right. It used to be fists. Now it's guns.

So what we need is for more people to have guns?? Sheesh.

Well, from a purely statistical point of view global warming is simply
a matter of population growth - more people more contaminates - so
essentially a couple of blokes shooting each other might be viewed as
their contribution to the lessoning of the world's CO2 overload :-)

Or perhaps, harking back to ancient times - The O.K. Corral, etc. -
they are lowlifes so we don't need them. Good riddance!
I'll note that the "ancient times" of the O.K. Corral had plenty of gun
control, often stricter than today.

https://www.smithsonianmag.com/histo...est-180968013/

Modern day wannabe cowboys have forgotten that.


--
- Frank Krygowski

Wasn't a demand that the Clantons and cowboys (outlaws) surrender their guns one of the main causes of the Gunfight at the OK Corral in the first place?

From Wikipedia:
"According to the Earps' version of events, the fight was in self-defense because the Cowboys, armed in violation of local ordinance, defied a lawful order to hand over their weapons and drew their pistols instead. The Cowboys maintained that they raised their hands, offered no resistance, and were shot in cold blood by the Earps. Sorting out who was telling the truth was difficult then and remains so to this day.[13]"

Yes. The idiot outlaws said, in effect, "You can take my gun when you
pry it out of my cold dead hands."

The lawmen obliged.


--
- Frank Krygowski

On 3/12/2021 4:02 AM, John B. wrote:
On Thu, 11 Mar 2021 22:53:45 -0500, Frank Krygowski
wrote:

On 3/11/2021 7:54 PM, John B. wrote:
On Thu, 11 Mar 2021 10:53:17 -0500, Frank Krygowski
wrote:

On 3/11/2021 10:27 AM, jbeattie wrote:
On Wednesday, March 10, 2021 at 11:35:02 PM UTC-8, Andre Jute wrote:
On Thursday, March 11, 2021 at 12:49:03 AM UTC, AMuzi wrote:
On 3/10/2021 6:38 PM, jbeattie wrote:
On Wednesday, March 10, 2021 at 2:18:17 PM UTC-8, AMuzi wrote:
On 3/10/2021 4:08 PM, Andre Jute wrote:
On Wednesday, March 10, 2021 at 6:50:21 PM UTC, AMuzi wrote:
On 3/10/2021 12:35 PM, Andre Jute wrote:
Lefties have no loyalty, but I'm not surprised Jay wants to make a runner for some place better run than Portland:

https://townhall.com/tipsheet/guyben...force-n2585894

Portland had as many murders in 2020 as the entire country of Ireland will have in over thirty years. Portland in three years and a bit will have as many did of gunshot and explosive wounds as Northern Ireland had in thirty years of terrorist violence and reprisals. That's a pretty elevated level of violence in Portland, which Jay has held up to us as "mostly peaceful".

If my country were as "peaceful" as the city of Portland, the police commissioner would long since have kissed his job goodbye, and the government would have fallen to a no-confidence vote after about three months.

Andre Jute
Just being reasonable

Ireland has half the population of Chicago GMA (more than
City of Chicago but not that much more). Portland GMA is
about 1/2 of Ireland.
.
Okay, like for like. On a base of 100K of the population, how many would be murdered in Ireland and in Portland?
.
In Ireland per 100K population, 0.87 would be murdered (1918). https://www.macrotrends.net/countrie...-homicide-rate
.
In Portland per 100K population, 4 would be murdered. Portland is safer than only 2 percent of US cities.
https://www.neighborhoodscout.com/or...me#description
.
The usual googlebugs can bus us more up to date numbers.
.
Not attacking or defending anyone here but those things
matter. Density probably as well.
.
Density for sure. You'd be amazed how fast rats turn viciously paranoid if they're crowded.

Personally, I think the number of firearms in circulation matters as well, but we can argue that case another day. Right now I'm arguing Donkey Party incompetence and irresponsibility.
.
Andre Jute
It's a slam-dunk case.

You could argue it, but to be fair you'd need a
not-dixiecrat-controlled major US city for comparison.
--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org/
Open every day since 1 April, 1971

Historically, Tulsa and Oklahoma City had a violent crime rates nearly twice that of Portland. This is a bad year, obviously, and I haven't compared current statistics.

I have (counting) five shooting cases on my desk -- all since the pandemic, four in strip club parking lots. I represent an insurer that writes strip clubs. it used to be they just fought, but now its guns.

Like I said, this year is an outlier, and we've had Democrat-ish (its non-partisan) mayors for the last 40 years.

-- Jay Beattie.





That's a very tough situation for a business owner:
https://apnews.com/4c7a568bfa07c98b90c0292c7e592923
(just down the road from here)

Similarly, an immigrant of my acquaintance, with his
extended family, literally built a restaurant (brick; took
almost two years) and successful business. After 20 years
of paying taxes and employing people, the permits were
yanked after a couple of thugs shot up the parking lot after
hours one night.

I expect a strip club manager to keep the customers' hands
off the dancers but not to search every car coming into the
parking lot, frisk the people inside or interrogate them.
That's an unreasonable standard.
--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org/
Open every day since 1 April, 1971
That's like stoking vigilantism and then decrying it because the politicians don't have the balls to keep a proper police force recruited, staffed, supplied and motivated. What a shower of dialectical fools. -- AJ

These strip club shootings are usually intimate affairs with no wind-up or little wind-up, and the reason for the shooting often is not obvious. Having a "proper police force" with balls (!) would do nothing more than speed apprehension of the shooter. It's not the Sharks and the Jets with Russ Tamblyn snapping his fingers and officer Krupke telling the boys to break it up. One shooting was inside a closed strip club with two young men doing maintenance and remodeling, and one shot the other. They were friends.

Increased police presence may prevent certain shootings, but not others. I've watched the video, and it is often a WTF moment where you cannot tell why on earth one guy is shooting the other guy. In one case in particular, a group of guys in a parking lot all look like friends -- and then shots. There is a usually a back-story.

Right. It used to be fists. Now it's guns.

So what we need is for more people to have guns?? Sheesh.

Well, from a purely statistical point of view global warming is simply
a matter of population growth - more people more contaminates - so
essentially a couple of blokes shooting each other might be viewed as
their contribution to the lessoning of the world's CO2 overload :-)

Or perhaps, harking back to ancient times - The O.K. Corral, etc. -
they are lowlifes so we don't need them. Good riddance!

I'll note that the "ancient times" of the O.K. Corral had plenty of gun
control, often stricter than today.

https://www.smithsonianmag.com/histo...est-180968013/

Modern day wannabe cowboys have forgotten that.

Gun control about where you could go armed not whether you could own a
weapon(s).

Yes, and the vogue among gun nuts is now to remove laws prohibiting
carrying guns on college campuses, in other public buildings, etc. How
timid does a person have to be to need to carry a gun into a library?

For decades I was on the board of our local nature preserve. There's no
hunting there, so we had a "no weapons" rule. A few years ago, some gun
nut challenged the rule. After some discussion about the cost of a legal
battle, the rule was rescinded.

And since, I've heard of one woman who jogs in there frequently with a
handgun tucked into her jogging tights. This in a forest preserve with a
history of zero assaults in its 100+ years of existence, in a community
twice rated one of the ten safest in the state.

Such paranoia! Gun nuts are wimps!


--
- Frank Krygowski

On 3/12/2021 10:04 AM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 3/12/2021 4:02 AM, John B. wrote:
On Thu, 11 Mar 2021 22:53:45 -0500, Frank Krygowski
wrote:

On 3/11/2021 7:54 PM, John B. wrote:
On Thu, 11 Mar 2021 10:53:17 -0500, Frank Krygowski
wrote:

On 3/11/2021 10:27 AM, jbeattie wrote:
On Wednesday, March 10, 2021 at 11:35:02 PM UTC-8,
Andre Jute wrote:
On Thursday, March 11, 2021 at 12:49:03 AM UTC, AMuzi
wrote:
On 3/10/2021 6:38 PM, jbeattie wrote:
On Wednesday, March 10, 2021 at 2:18:17 PM UTC-8,
AMuzi wrote:
On 3/10/2021 4:08 PM, Andre Jute wrote:
On Wednesday, March 10, 2021 at 6:50:21 PM UTC,
AMuzi wrote:
On 3/10/2021 12:35 PM, Andre Jute wrote:
Lefties have no loyalty, but I'm not surprised
Jay wants to make a runner for some place
better run than Portland:

https://townhall.com/tipsheet/guyben...force-n2585894


Portland had as many murders in 2020 as the
entire country of Ireland will have in over
thirty years. Portland in three years and a bit
will have as many did of gunshot and explosive
wounds as Northern Ireland had in thirty years
of terrorist violence and reprisals. That's a
pretty elevated level of violence in Portland,
which Jay has held up to us as "mostly peaceful".

If my country were as "peaceful" as the city of
Portland, the police commissioner would long
since have kissed his job goodbye, and the
government would have fallen to a no-confidence
vote after about three months.

Andre Jute
Just being reasonable

Ireland has half the population of Chicago GMA
(more than
City of Chicago but not that much more).
Portland GMA is
about 1/2 of Ireland.
.
Okay, like for like. On a base of 100K of the
population, how many would be murdered in Ireland
and in Portland?
.
In Ireland per 100K population, 0.87 would be
murdered (1918).
https://www.macrotrends.net/countrie...-homicide-rate

.
In Portland per 100K population, 4 would be
murdered. Portland is safer than only 2 percent
of US cities.
https://www.neighborhoodscout.com/or...me#description

.
The usual googlebugs can bus us more up to date
numbers.
.
Not attacking or defending anyone here but those
things
matter. Density probably as well.
.
Density for sure. You'd be amazed how fast rats
turn viciously paranoid if they're crowded.

Personally, I think the number of firearms in
circulation matters as well, but we can argue
that case another day. Right now I'm arguing
Donkey Party incompetence and irresponsibility.
.
Andre Jute
It's a slam-dunk case.

You could argue it, but to be fair you'd need a
not-dixiecrat-controlled major US city for
comparison.
--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org/
Open every day since 1 April, 1971

Historically, Tulsa and Oklahoma City had a violent
crime rates nearly twice that of Portland. This is
a bad year, obviously, and I haven't compared
current statistics.

I have (counting) five shooting cases on my desk --
all since the pandemic, four in strip club parking
lots. I represent an insurer that writes strip
clubs. it used to be they just fought, but now its
guns.

Like I said, this year is an outlier, and we've had
Democrat-ish (its non-partisan) mayors for the last
40 years.

-- Jay Beattie.





That's a very tough situation for a business owner:
https://apnews.com/4c7a568bfa07c98b90c0292c7e592923
(just down the road from here)

Similarly, an immigrant of my acquaintance, with his
extended family, literally built a restaurant
(brick; took
almost two years) and successful business. After 20
years
of paying taxes and employing people, the permits were
yanked after a couple of thugs shot up the parking
lot after
hours one night.

I expect a strip club manager to keep the customers'
hands
off the dancers but not to search every car coming
into the
parking lot, frisk the people inside or interrogate
them.
That's an unreasonable standard.
--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org/
Open every day since 1 April, 1971
That's like stoking vigilantism and then decrying it
because the politicians don't have the balls to keep
a proper police force recruited, staffed, supplied
and motivated. What a shower of dialectical fools. -- AJ

These strip club shootings are usually intimate
affairs with no wind-up or little wind-up, and the
reason for the shooting often is not obvious. Having
a "proper police force" with balls (!) would do
nothing more than speed apprehension of the shooter.
It's not the Sharks and the Jets with Russ Tamblyn
snapping his fingers and officer Krupke telling the
boys to break it up. One shooting was inside a closed
strip club with two young men doing maintenance and
remodeling, and one shot the other. They were friends.

Increased police presence may prevent certain
shootings, but not others. I've watched the video,
and it is often a WTF moment where you cannot tell why
on earth one guy is shooting the other guy. In one
case in particular, a group of guys in a parking lot
all look like friends -- and then shots. There is a
usually a back-story.

Right. It used to be fists. Now it's guns.

So what we need is for more people to have guns?? Sheesh.

Well, from a purely statistical point of view global
warming is simply
a matter of population growth - more people more
contaminates - so
essentially a couple of blokes shooting each other might
be viewed as
their contribution to the lessoning of the world's CO2
overload :-)

Or perhaps, harking back to ancient times - The O.K.
Corral, etc. -
they are lowlifes so we don't need them. Good riddance!

I'll note that the "ancient times" of the O.K. Corral had
plenty of gun
control, often stricter than today.

https://www.smithsonianmag.com/histo...est-180968013/


Modern day wannabe cowboys have forgotten that.

Gun control about where you could go armed not whether you
could own a
weapon(s).

Yes, and the vogue among gun nuts is now to remove laws
prohibiting carrying guns on college campuses, in other
public buildings, etc. How timid does a person have to be to
need to carry a gun into a library?

For decades I was on the board of our local nature preserve.
There's no hunting there, so we had a "no weapons" rule. A
few years ago, some gun nut challenged the rule. After some
discussion about the cost of a legal battle, the rule was
rescinded.

And since, I've heard of one woman who jogs in there
frequently with a handgun tucked into her jogging tights.
This in a forest preserve with a history of zero assaults in
its 100+ years of existence, in a community twice rated one
of the ten safest in the state.

Such paranoia! Gun nuts are wimps!



In the 2008 St Valentine's Day shooting at NIU

(official statement about the maniac, 'an excellent student
with no criminal history' is a complete lie:
https://www.esquire.com/news-politic...mierczak-0808/
)

Among the students was an Army vet with his legal and
permitted 9mm. It was locked in his car glovebox because
firearms are too dangerous on campus. Which stops law
abiding citizens but not maniacs.


--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org/
Open every day since 1 April, 1971

On 3/12/2021 1:14 PM, AMuzi wrote:
On 3/12/2021 10:04 AM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 3/12/2021 4:02 AM, John B. wrote:
On Thu, 11 Mar 2021 22:53:45 -0500, Frank Krygowski
wrote:

On 3/11/2021 7:54 PM, John B. wrote:
On Thu, 11 Mar 2021 10:53:17 -0500, Frank Krygowski
wrote:

On 3/11/2021 10:27 AM, jbeattie wrote:
On Wednesday, March 10, 2021 at 11:35:02 PM UTC-8,
Andre Jute wrote:
On Thursday, March 11, 2021 at 12:49:03 AM UTC, AMuzi
wrote:
On 3/10/2021 6:38 PM, jbeattie wrote:
On Wednesday, March 10, 2021 at 2:18:17 PM UTC-8,
AMuzi wrote:
On 3/10/2021 4:08 PM, Andre Jute wrote:
On Wednesday, March 10, 2021 at 6:50:21 PM UTC,
AMuzi wrote:
On 3/10/2021 12:35 PM, Andre Jute wrote:
Lefties have no loyalty, but I'm not surprised
Jay wants to make a runner for some place
better run than Portland:

https://townhall.com/tipsheet/guyben...force-n2585894



Portland had as many murders in 2020 as the
entire country of Ireland will have in over
thirty years. Portland in three years and a bit
will have as many did of gunshot and explosive
wounds as Northern Ireland had in thirty years
of terrorist violence and reprisals. That's a
pretty elevated level of violence in Portland,
which Jay has held up to us as "mostly peaceful".

If my country were as "peaceful" as the city of
Portland, the police commissioner would long
since have kissed his job goodbye, and the
government would have fallen to a no-confidence
vote after about three months.

Andre Jute
Just being reasonable

Ireland has half the population of Chicago GMA
(more than
City of Chicago but not that much more).
Portland GMA is
about 1/2 of Ireland.
.
Okay, like for like. On a base of 100K of the
population, how many would be murdered in Ireland
and in Portland?
.
In Ireland per 100K population, 0.87 would be
murdered (1918).
https://www.macrotrends.net/countrie...-homicide-rate


.
In Portland per 100K population, 4 would be
murdered. Portland is safer than only 2 percent
of US cities.
https://www.neighborhoodscout.com/or...me#description

.
The usual googlebugs can bus us more up to date
numbers.
.
Not attacking or defending anyone here but those
things
matter. Density probably as well.
.
Density for sure. You'd be amazed how fast rats
turn viciously paranoid if they're crowded.

Personally, I think the number of firearms in
circulation matters as well, but we can argue
that case another day. Right now I'm arguing
Donkey Party incompetence and irresponsibility.
.
Andre Jute
It's a slam-dunk case.

You could argue it, but to be fair you'd need a
not-dixiecrat-controlled major US city for
comparison.
--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org/
Open every day since 1 April, 1971

Historically, Tulsa and Oklahoma City had a violent
crime rates nearly twice that of Portland. This is
a bad year, obviously, and I haven't compared
current statistics.

I have (counting) five shooting cases on my desk --
all since the pandemic, four in strip club parking
lots. I represent an insurer that writes strip
clubs. it used to be they just fought, but now its
guns.

Like I said, this year is an outlier, and we've had
Democrat-ish (its non-partisan) mayors for the last
40 years.

-- Jay Beattie.





That's a very tough situation for a business owner:
https://apnews.com/4c7a568bfa07c98b90c0292c7e592923
(just down the road from here)

Similarly, an immigrant of my acquaintance, with his
extended family, literally built a restaurant
(brick; took
almost two years) and successful business. After 20
years
of paying taxes and employing people, the permits were
yanked after a couple of thugs shot up the parking
lot after
hours one night.

I expect a strip club manager to keep the customers'
hands
off the dancers but not to search every car coming
into the
parking lot, frisk the people inside or interrogate
them.
That's an unreasonable standard.
--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org/
Open every day since 1 April, 1971
That's like stoking vigilantism and then decrying it
because the politicians don't have the balls to keep
a proper police force recruited, staffed, supplied
and motivated. What a shower of dialectical fools. -- AJ

These strip club shootings are usually intimate
affairs with no wind-up or little wind-up, and the
reason for the shooting often is not obvious.Â* Having
a "proper police force" with balls (!) would do
nothing more than speed apprehension of the shooter.
It's not the Sharks and the Jets with Russ Tamblyn
snapping his fingers and officer Krupke telling the
boys to break it up.Â* One shooting was inside a closed
strip club with two young men doing maintenance and
remodeling, and one shot the other. They were friends.

Increased police presence may prevent certain
shootings, but not others.Â* I've watched the video,
and it is often a WTF moment where you cannot tell why
on earth one guy is shooting the other guy.Â* In one
case in particular,Â* a group of guys in a parking lot
all look like friends -- and then shots.Â* There is a
usually a back-story.

Right. It used to be fists. Now it's guns.

So what we need is for more people to have guns??Â* Sheesh.

Well, from a purely statistical point of view global
warming is simply
a matter of population growth - more people more
contaminates - so
essentially a couple of blokes shooting each other might
be viewed as
their contribution to the lessoning of the world's CO2
overload :-)

Or perhaps, harking back to ancient times - The O.K.
Corral, etc. -
they are lowlifes so we don't need them. Good riddance!

I'll note that the "ancient times" of the O.K. Corral had
plenty of gun
control, often stricter than today.

https://www.smithsonianmag.com/histo...est-180968013/


Modern day wannabe cowboys have forgotten that.

Gun control about where you could go armed not whether you
could own a
weapon(s).

Yes, and the vogue among gun nuts is now to remove laws
prohibiting carrying guns on college campuses, in other
public buildings, etc. How timid does a person have to be to
need to carry a gun into a library?

For decades I was on the board of our local nature preserve.
There's no hunting there, so we had a "no weapons" rule. A
few years ago, some gun nut challenged the rule. After some
discussion about the cost of a legal battle, the rule was
rescinded.

And since, I've heard of one woman who jogs in there
frequently with a handgun tucked into her jogging tights.
This in a forest preserve with a history of zero assaults in
its 100+ years of existence, in a community twice rated one
of the ten safest in the state.

Such paranoia! Gun nuts are wimps!



In the 2008 St Valentine's Day shooting at NIU

(official statement about the maniac, 'an excellent student with no
criminal history' is a complete lie:
https://www.esquire.com/news-politic...mierczak-0808/ Â*)

Among the students was an Army vet with his legal and permitted 9mm. It
was locked in his car glovebox because firearms are too dangerous on
campus.Â* Which stops law abiding citizens but not maniacs.

But we must let maniacs buy guns.

"He applies for his firearms permit in December and receives it in
January. He's been out of the mental-health system for five years now,
so he's eligible. ... In February he buys a Glock .45-caliber handgun, a
powerful weapon. He buys a shotgun and another handgun the next month.
Goes to the shooting range instead of school."

and "That same day he decides to buy guns. Perhaps it's just a whim. Or
maybe he's concerned that his visit to the hospital will go on his
mental-health record and his gun license will be revoked. He drives to
Tony's Guns & Ammo, which is just Tony's house. Steve trades in his
Glock .45 caliber, his .22-caliber pistol, and his 20-gauge shotgun. He
buys a Sig Sauer .380."

The guy was crazy. He shouldn't have owned any guns, and most of the
guns he bought have no legitimate use by even sane civilians.

And anybody reading the end of that article from "Valentine's Day. 3:04
p.m." onward should know the 9mm in the glovebox wasn't the problem. And
it wouldn't have been the solution.

--
- Frank Krygowski