Bidens on bikes!!!!!!!!!!

On Wednesday, June 9, 2021 at 3:41:08 PM UTC-5, Radey Shouman wrote:
No visas were required for aliens wishing to enter the US prior to 1918,
were we not then a nation?

Although the origins of passports date back to the 400s BCE and customs officers to collect import duties for centuries, WW1 is when restrictions on immigration were formally introduced, especially the Ottoman empire forcing Armenians to leave their home and cross back to where their ethnicity were in the majority. This establish the precedence for Germany to exile Jews and the Indian / Pakistan (Bangledish) migrations.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Passport

https://www.mfa.gov.tr/the-events-of...verview.en.mfa

Mike A Schwab writes:

On Wednesday, June 9, 2021 at 3:41:08 PM UTC-5, Radey Shouman wrote:
No visas were required for aliens wishing to enter the US prior to 1918,
were we not then a nation?

Although the origins of passports date back to the 400s BCE and
customs officers to collect import duties for centuries, WW1 is when
restrictions on immigration were formally introduced, especially the
Ottoman empire forcing Armenians to leave their home and cross back to
where their ethnicity were in the majority. This establish the
precedence for Germany to exile Jews and the Indian / Pakistan
(Bangledish) migrations.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Passport

https://www.mfa.gov.tr/the-events-of...verview.en.mfa

At least in the US, restrictions on entry were sold as emergency
measures, like the income tax. Oddly enough both are still going
strong.

On Wed, 09 Jun 2021 19:29:32 -0500, AMuzi wrote:

On 6/9/2021 6:16 PM, Tom Kunich wrote:
On Wednesday, June 9, 2021 at 3:52:47 PM UTC-7, AMuzi wrote:
On 6/9/2021 5:14 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 6/9/2021 2:41 PM, AMuzi wrote:
On 6/9/2021 1:05 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 6/9/2021 1:39 PM, AMuzi wrote:
On 6/9/2021 10:26 AM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 6/9/2021 8:19 AM, AMuzi wrote:
On 6/8/2021 9:27 PM, John B. wrote:
On Tue, 8 Jun 2021 21:53:59 -0400, Frank Krygowski
wrote:

On 6/8/2021 3:11 PM, Tom Kunich wrote:
On Monday, June 7, 2021 at 8:26:06 PM UTC-7, John B.
wrote:
On Mon, 7 Jun 2021 22:37:41 -0400, Frank Krygowski
wrote:

On 6/7/2021 6:09 PM, AMuzi wrote:
On 6/7/2021 4:58 PM, wrote:
On Sunday, June 6, 2021 at 12:56:51 PM UTC-5,
wrote:
"insurrection" when you know damn well that it
was
not an
insurrection since there was NO arms of any sort
used and that the
only fatality was 3 people who had heart attacks
at the rally and the
one woman who was murdered by that capital police
officer who has
remained unnamed.

And yet when the cops murder and shoot down the
protesters at BLM
rallies, protests, they are canonized as saints
and
martyrs by your
side. And any court proceeding against the cops is
demonized. Odd.


Was there an instance of police shooting protesters
last year? I must
have missed that.

I do remember several innocent bystanders, business
owners and policemen
murdered by mobs:

https://www.theguardian.com/world/20...l-unrest-acled




And returning to a mode of thought I frequently use:

I wonder how many people die in protests in Canada?
Or Great Britain? Or
Germany ... etc.
Perhaps it is not simply "protests" The intentional
homicide rate in
Canada is 1.76/100,000, in G.B. 1.20, in Germany 0.95
and in the U.S.
it is 4.96.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_o..._homicide_rate




And yet you stupid SOB - why did you leave out
Jamaica with 56
Venezuela with 50
Belize with 38
South Africa with 36
San Lucia with 29
Dominica with 27
Guatemala with 26
Mexico with 26
or even Russia with TWICE the level as the US?

Why don't you mention that Biden and the Democrats
have
been inviting
PEOPLE from ALL of these countries to come to the US and
bring their
quaint ways with them?

???

"Kamala Harris to Potential Migrants: ‘Do Not Come’"

https://news.yahoo.com/kamala-harris...194611043.html




Gee... "PEOPLE from ALL of these countries to come to
the
US and bring
their quaint ways with them?" Goodness Gracious! People
with names
like Kunich, Krygowski, Muzi ?


There is an orderly process with both Constitutional
basis
and a host of applicable statutes. My son in law spent 8
years to become a USAian which is typical of legal
immigration (and I have sponsored immigrants who also
completed theirs). An open border is not at all relevant
to the subject.

I've personally "sponsored" only one immigrant (that is,
helped him arrive here and apply for political asylum).
I've
worked with many immigrants, I have several immigrant
friends and other immigrant acquaintances. Some of those
acquaintances may be illegal; I've never asked.

But I've never spoken with anyone who advocated "open
borders." I'm sure those people may exist, but I take them
no more seriously than the nuts who say "I'm taking my
yard
and seceding from the United States."



Meanwhile the border is open.

https://wflanews.iheart.com/featured...-county-woman/



CBP agents report that most of the staff has been
reassigned to processing of illegals rather than actual
border enforcement. There are virtually no deportations
any longer. And those 'helpless children' are 90% single
males between 15 and 21.

These are not new problems and a complete solution is not
possible but these are real problems:

https://policetribune.com/advocate-f...rtation-order/



The border is not "open" any more than all bike shops are
always "open." Bike shop and other burglaries happen despite
reasonable security.

Actually, your position on this is sort of flipped from your
usual position. You've repeatedly argued against gun laws,
saying "How is the prohibition on drugs working out?".

For consistency, you should be saying we shouldn't have
border security.


Extend the argument and you get to 'we are not a nation'.
That's too far over the line for me.

My argument is in favor of laws, even though I understand
that no laws are perfectly obeyed.

I've never said it's a good idea to let anyone and everyone
into the USA. Likewise, I've never said it's a good idea to
let anyone and everyone own rapid fire guns with capacity
for lots of rounds.

I think my position is pretty consistent.

Well THAT'S a relief.
When The Powers That Be decide I can't have one of these,
maybe I could borrow yours?

https://www.military.com/equipment/m4-carbine

According to Franks every one of those "killed" at protests was jus standing around and doing nuttin. They were burning and looting or pointing a gun at a cop or throwing Molotov cocktails.

It was like his bull**** about George Floyd who according to Frank was killed by a cop kneeing on his neck and purposely asphyxiating him. To bad the lapel cameras of the cops had a completely different story. The cops were serving a warrant for his arrest as he was sitting in the back seat of his pusher's car after having purchased and consumed a ton of fentanyl after being off of it for 6 weeks or so while he was in prison. You can tell that he had taken it BEFORE the cops got there and not swallowed it to hide it because he was saying "I can't breath" before he got out of the back of the pusher's car. This was shown by the lapel cameras of the police. They placed him in the back of the police SUV and he started having an overdose toxicity seizure and slid out of the car and onto the ground next to the police car. With the seizure in progress the partner called an ambulance and Officer Chauvin tried to keep him still and kneels in Floyd's shoulder with his RIGHT knee. From the a
ngle that smartphone video was taken it APPEARED that Chauvin was kneeling on his neck with his LEFT knee but he wasn't because Floyd could be plainly heard saying "I can't breath". So there was NO pressure on his neck that could cause any sort of medical problems.

Leftists have never a thought in their heads that looks can be sometimes deceiving. In Franks case, he is simply anti-conservative and he would believe absolutely any lie without questioning a word of it if he though he could use it to bludgeon any conservative. Let's see how Frank likes it after Biden prices everything out of his reach and then gives extra money to the illegal aliens.


You'll never become a member of The Party writing things
like that. You probably watched the entire video series (as
did I) but not the edited version presented to the jury.

Mr Chauvin was convicted. You or I may well be next.

Police (and military) have a very "then and us" perception of life and
I suspect that punishing a Cop for restraining someone accused of
using counterfeit money will result in extremely slow responses to
future calls for police assistance.
--
Cheers,

John B.

On 6/9/2021 8:00 PM, jbeattie wrote:
On Wednesday, June 9, 2021 at 5:29:39 PM UTC-7, AMuzi wrote:
On 6/9/2021 6:16 PM, Tom Kunich wrote:
On Wednesday, June 9, 2021 at 3:52:47 PM UTC-7, AMuzi wrote:
On 6/9/2021 5:14 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 6/9/2021 2:41 PM, AMuzi wrote:
On 6/9/2021 1:05 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 6/9/2021 1:39 PM, AMuzi wrote:
On 6/9/2021 10:26 AM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 6/9/2021 8:19 AM, AMuzi wrote:
On 6/8/2021 9:27 PM, John B. wrote:
On Tue, 8 Jun 2021 21:53:59 -0400, Frank Krygowski
wrote:

On 6/8/2021 3:11 PM, Tom Kunich wrote:
On Monday, June 7, 2021 at 8:26:06 PM UTC-7, John B.
wrote:
On Mon, 7 Jun 2021 22:37:41 -0400, Frank Krygowski
wrote:

On 6/7/2021 6:09 PM, AMuzi wrote:
On 6/7/2021 4:58 PM, wrote:
On Sunday, June 6, 2021 at 12:56:51 PM UTC-5,
wrote:
"insurrection" when you know damn well that it
was
not an
insurrection since there was NO arms of any sort
used and that the
only fatality was 3 people who had heart attacks
at the rally and the
one woman who was murdered by that capital police
officer who has
remained unnamed.

And yet when the cops murder and shoot down the
protesters at BLM
rallies, protests, they are canonized as saints
and
martyrs by your
side. And any court proceeding against the cops is
demonized. Odd.


Was there an instance of police shooting protesters
last year? I must
have missed that.

I do remember several innocent bystanders, business
owners and policemen
murdered by mobs:

https://www.theguardian.com/world/20...l-unrest-acled




And returning to a mode of thought I frequently use:

I wonder how many people die in protests in Canada?
Or Great Britain? Or
Germany ... etc.
Perhaps it is not simply "protests" The intentional
homicide rate in
Canada is 1.76/100,000, in G.B. 1.20, in Germany 0.95
and in the U.S.
it is 4.96.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_o..._homicide_rate




And yet you stupid SOB - why did you leave out
Jamaica with 56
Venezuela with 50
Belize with 38
South Africa with 36
San Lucia with 29
Dominica with 27
Guatemala with 26
Mexico with 26
or even Russia with TWICE the level as the US?

Why don't you mention that Biden and the Democrats
have
been inviting
PEOPLE from ALL of these countries to come to the US and
bring their
quaint ways with them?

???

"Kamala Harris to Potential Migrants: ‘Do Not Come’"

https://news.yahoo.com/kamala-harris...194611043.html




Gee... "PEOPLE from ALL of these countries to come to
the
US and bring
their quaint ways with them?" Goodness Gracious! People
with names
like Kunich, Krygowski, Muzi ?


There is an orderly process with both Constitutional
basis
and a host of applicable statutes. My son in law spent 8
years to become a USAian which is typical of legal
immigration (and I have sponsored immigrants who also
completed theirs). An open border is not at all relevant
to the subject.

I've personally "sponsored" only one immigrant (that is,
helped him arrive here and apply for political asylum).
I've
worked with many immigrants, I have several immigrant
friends and other immigrant acquaintances. Some of those
acquaintances may be illegal; I've never asked.

But I've never spoken with anyone who advocated "open
borders." I'm sure those people may exist, but I take them
no more seriously than the nuts who say "I'm taking my
yard
and seceding from the United States."



Meanwhile the border is open.

https://wflanews.iheart.com/featured...-county-woman/



CBP agents report that most of the staff has been
reassigned to processing of illegals rather than actual
border enforcement. There are virtually no deportations
any longer. And those 'helpless children' are 90% single
males between 15 and 21.

These are not new problems and a complete solution is not
possible but these are real problems:

https://policetribune.com/advocate-f...rtation-order/



The border is not "open" any more than all bike shops are
always "open." Bike shop and other burglaries happen despite
reasonable security.

Actually, your position on this is sort of flipped from your
usual position. You've repeatedly argued against gun laws,
saying "How is the prohibition on drugs working out?".

For consistency, you should be saying we shouldn't have
border security.


Extend the argument and you get to 'we are not a nation'.
That's too far over the line for me.

My argument is in favor of laws, even though I understand
that no laws are perfectly obeyed.

I've never said it's a good idea to let anyone and everyone
into the USA. Likewise, I've never said it's a good idea to
let anyone and everyone own rapid fire guns with capacity
for lots of rounds.

I think my position is pretty consistent.

Well THAT'S a relief.
When The Powers That Be decide I can't have one of these,
maybe I could borrow yours?

https://www.military.com/equipment/m4-carbine

According to Franks every one of those "killed" at protests was jus standing around and doing nuttin. They were burning and looting or pointing a gun at a cop or throwing Molotov cocktails.

It was like his bull**** about George Floyd who according to Frank was killed by a cop kneeing on his neck and purposely asphyxiating him. To bad the lapel cameras of the cops had a completely different story. The cops were serving a warrant for his arrest as he was sitting in the back seat of his pusher's car after having purchased and consumed a ton of fentanyl after being off of it for 6 weeks or so while he was in prison. You can tell that he had taken it BEFORE the cops got there and not swallowed it to hide it because he was saying "I can't breath" before he got out of the back of the pusher's car. This was shown by the lapel cameras of the police. They placed him in the back of the police SUV and he started having an overdose toxicity seizure and slid out of the car and onto the ground next to the police car. With the seizure in progress the partner called an ambulance and Officer Chauvin tried to keep him still and kneels in Floyd's shoulder with his RIGHT knee. From the
a
ngle that smartphone video was taken it APPEARED that Chauvin was kneeling on his neck with his LEFT knee but he wasn't because Floyd could be plainly heard saying "I can't breath". So there was NO pressure on his neck that could cause any sort of medical problems.

Leftists have never a thought in their heads that looks can be sometimes deceiving. In Franks case, he is simply anti-conservative and he would believe absolutely any lie without questioning a word of it if he though he could use it to bludgeon any conservative. Let's see how Frank likes it after Biden prices everything out of his reach and then gives extra money to the illegal aliens.

You'll never become a member of The Party writing things
like that. You probably watched the entire video series (as
did I) but not the edited version presented to the jury.

Mr Chauvin was convicted. You or I may well be next.

Unlikely, unless you have your knee on someone's neck for a very long time. I worked with cops all the time back in the ambulance days -- and I relied on them to keep me safe, but they could do some pretty stupid things, like break arms, choke people to death, etc. That was bad. I watched one cop break an arm, which was kind of gruesome. I was always O.K. with carnage that had occurred, but I hated carnage that was in the process of occurring.

Even back in the '70s, there was a response team in the Santa Clara Valley that would handle psych claims -- "ITS" (Immediate Treatment Service). It was the white jacket and tennis shoe guys with syringes full of Thorazine. The cops would corral the crazy guys, and ITS would hit them up with Thorazine or some other phenothiazine. We'd haul them off to VMC. A lot of police calls should be handled by the white-jacket guys, IMO. I'm absolutely not for defunding, but we do need some real psych ninjas out there.

-- Jay Beattie.


None of this is simple. You suggest something like this
5-man 'special crisis intervention team' with experience
handling nutcases and maniacs?

https://www.cnn.com/2019/08/02/us/da...ath/index.html

Mr Timpa didn't even have several times the lethal dose of
Fentanyl in him. He died anyway.

There's no 'nice' way to subdue a nutcase or a flailing OD
case. Before you ask, no, I don't have a snappy solution either.

--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org/
Open every day since 1 April, 1971

On 6/9/2021 9:06 PM, John B. wrote:
On Wed, 09 Jun 2021 19:29:32 -0500, AMuzi wrote:

On 6/9/2021 6:16 PM, Tom Kunich wrote:
On Wednesday, June 9, 2021 at 3:52:47 PM UTC-7, AMuzi wrote:
On 6/9/2021 5:14 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 6/9/2021 2:41 PM, AMuzi wrote:
On 6/9/2021 1:05 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 6/9/2021 1:39 PM, AMuzi wrote:
On 6/9/2021 10:26 AM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 6/9/2021 8:19 AM, AMuzi wrote:
On 6/8/2021 9:27 PM, John B. wrote:
On Tue, 8 Jun 2021 21:53:59 -0400, Frank Krygowski
wrote:

On 6/8/2021 3:11 PM, Tom Kunich wrote:
On Monday, June 7, 2021 at 8:26:06 PM UTC-7, John B.
wrote:
On Mon, 7 Jun 2021 22:37:41 -0400, Frank Krygowski
wrote:

On 6/7/2021 6:09 PM, AMuzi wrote:
On 6/7/2021 4:58 PM, wrote:
On Sunday, June 6, 2021 at 12:56:51 PM UTC-5,
wrote:
"insurrection" when you know damn well that it
was
not an
insurrection since there was NO arms of any sort
used and that the
only fatality was 3 people who had heart attacks
at the rally and the
one woman who was murdered by that capital police
officer who has
remained unnamed.

And yet when the cops murder and shoot down the
protesters at BLM
rallies, protests, they are canonized as saints
and
martyrs by your
side. And any court proceeding against the cops is
demonized. Odd.


Was there an instance of police shooting protesters
last year? I must
have missed that.

I do remember several innocent bystanders, business
owners and policemen
murdered by mobs:

https://www.theguardian.com/world/20...l-unrest-acled




And returning to a mode of thought I frequently use:

I wonder how many people die in protests in Canada?
Or Great Britain? Or
Germany ... etc.
Perhaps it is not simply "protests" The intentional
homicide rate in
Canada is 1.76/100,000, in G.B. 1.20, in Germany 0.95
and in the U.S.
it is 4.96.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_o..._homicide_rate




And yet you stupid SOB - why did you leave out
Jamaica with 56
Venezuela with 50
Belize with 38
South Africa with 36
San Lucia with 29
Dominica with 27
Guatemala with 26
Mexico with 26
or even Russia with TWICE the level as the US?

Why don't you mention that Biden and the Democrats
have
been inviting
PEOPLE from ALL of these countries to come to the US and
bring their
quaint ways with them?

???

"Kamala Harris to Potential Migrants: ‘Do Not Come’"

https://news.yahoo.com/kamala-harris...194611043.html




Gee... "PEOPLE from ALL of these countries to come to
the
US and bring
their quaint ways with them?" Goodness Gracious! People
with names
like Kunich, Krygowski, Muzi ?


There is an orderly process with both Constitutional
basis
and a host of applicable statutes. My son in law spent 8
years to become a USAian which is typical of legal
immigration (and I have sponsored immigrants who also
completed theirs). An open border is not at all relevant
to the subject.

I've personally "sponsored" only one immigrant (that is,
helped him arrive here and apply for political asylum).
I've
worked with many immigrants, I have several immigrant
friends and other immigrant acquaintances. Some of those
acquaintances may be illegal; I've never asked.

But I've never spoken with anyone who advocated "open
borders." I'm sure those people may exist, but I take them
no more seriously than the nuts who say "I'm taking my
yard
and seceding from the United States."



Meanwhile the border is open.

https://wflanews.iheart.com/featured...-county-woman/



CBP agents report that most of the staff has been
reassigned to processing of illegals rather than actual
border enforcement. There are virtually no deportations
any longer. And those 'helpless children' are 90% single
males between 15 and 21.

These are not new problems and a complete solution is not
possible but these are real problems:

https://policetribune.com/advocate-f...rtation-order/



The border is not "open" any more than all bike shops are
always "open." Bike shop and other burglaries happen despite
reasonable security.

Actually, your position on this is sort of flipped from your
usual position. You've repeatedly argued against gun laws,
saying "How is the prohibition on drugs working out?".

For consistency, you should be saying we shouldn't have
border security.


Extend the argument and you get to 'we are not a nation'.
That's too far over the line for me.

My argument is in favor of laws, even though I understand
that no laws are perfectly obeyed.

I've never said it's a good idea to let anyone and everyone
into the USA. Likewise, I've never said it's a good idea to
let anyone and everyone own rapid fire guns with capacity
for lots of rounds.

I think my position is pretty consistent.

Well THAT'S a relief.
When The Powers That Be decide I can't have one of these,
maybe I could borrow yours?

https://www.military.com/equipment/m4-carbine

According to Franks every one of those "killed" at protests was jus standing around and doing nuttin. They were burning and looting or pointing a gun at a cop or throwing Molotov cocktails.

It was like his bull**** about George Floyd who according to Frank was killed by a cop kneeing on his neck and purposely asphyxiating him. To bad the lapel cameras of the cops had a completely different story. The cops were serving a warrant for his arrest as he was sitting in the back seat of his pusher's car after having purchased and consumed a ton of fentanyl after being off of it for 6 weeks or so while he was in prison. You can tell that he had taken it BEFORE the cops got there and not swallowed it to hide it because he was saying "I can't breath" before he got out of the back of the pusher's car. This was shown by the lapel cameras of the police. They placed him in the back of the police SUV and he started having an overdose toxicity seizure and slid out of the car and onto the ground next to the police car. With the seizure in progress the partner called an ambulance and Officer Chauvin tried to keep him still and kneels in Floyd's shoulder with his RIGHT knee. From the
a
ngle that smartphone video was taken it APPEARED that Chauvin was kneeling on his neck with his LEFT knee but he wasn't because Floyd could be plainly heard saying "I can't breath". So there was NO pressure on his neck that could cause any sort of medical problems.

Leftists have never a thought in their heads that looks can be sometimes deceiving. In Franks case, he is simply anti-conservative and he would believe absolutely any lie without questioning a word of it if he though he could use it to bludgeon any conservative. Let's see how Frank likes it after Biden prices everything out of his reach and then gives extra money to the illegal aliens.


You'll never become a member of The Party writing things
like that. You probably watched the entire video series (as
did I) but not the edited version presented to the jury.

Mr Chauvin was convicted. You or I may well be next.

Police (and military) have a very "then and us" perception of life and
I suspect that punishing a Cop for restraining someone accused of
using counterfeit money will result in extremely slow responses to
future calls for police assistance.

+1

https://duckduckgo.com/?q=what+is+th...&t=h_&ia=w eb

--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org/
Open every day since 1 April, 1971

On Thu, 10 Jun 2021 08:43:03 +0700, John B.
wrote:

On Wed, 09 Jun 2021 17:46:16 -0500, AMuzi wrote:
A lot has changed.

In 1900, total US tax burden, local, county, state and
federal was under 10% of GDP. One might bemoan the ethos
'work or starve' but that's how it was generally.

But it was an accepted fact of life. To be too lazy to work was proof
that one was a useless burden on society. I can remember my mother
telling me, "Don't play with them, they are on the town".

My parents and I emigrated from Germany to the US in 1952-1953. At
the time, relatives living in New York had to sponsor us to guarantee
that we would not be a burden to the New York tax payers.

One also had to become a naturalized state citizen which entitled a
person to pay state taxes and collect benefits from the state. That's
still the situation on many states:
https://www.naturalizeny.org
https://www.bretzlaw.com/practice-areas/citizenship/how-long/
That usually takes 5 years. For US citizenship, 10 years.

As Milton Friedman famously concluded 'You can have a
welfare state or open borders, but not both.' I think he
makes a very good point.

I remember reading a statement made by a politician - I really don't
remember who - who stated that, "it is foolish to allow those on the
dole to vote as certainly they will vote for the dole".

That applies to any form of voting and to more than those on welfare.
Given the opportunity, ordinary voters will happily vote themselves a
free lunch. California did that on a grand scale in 1988 by voting
themselves a 20% insurance discount. That resulted in insurance
companies refusing to write new contracts:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Proposition_103

Add in other social/cultural changes and open borders are
IMHO a clear and present danger. We have plenty of dangers
here already.

Yep. The first thing the new immigrants do is bring in their
relatives. Then, the vote to slam the door behind them and admit no
more "undesirables".

--
Jeff Liebermann
PO Box 272 http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Ben Lomond CA 95005-0272
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558

On Wed, 09 Jun 2021 20:10:31 -0700, Jeff Liebermann
wrote:
One also had to become a naturalized state citizen which entitled a
person to pay state taxes and collect benefits from the state. That's
still the situation on many states:
https://www.naturalizeny.org
https://www.bretzlaw.com/practice-areas/citizenship/how-long/
That usually takes 5 years. For US citizenship, 10 years.

Oops. That should be 5 years for US citizenship:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Citizenship_of_the_United_States

--
Jeff Liebermann
PO Box 272 http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Ben Lomond CA 95005-0272
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558

On 6/9/2021 8:10 PM, Jeff Liebermann wrote:

snip

That applies to any form of voting and to more than those on welfare.

Thankfully, corporate welfare requires only paying legislators to pass
laws that benefit the corporation financially. It's much more efficient
than bothering with pesky elections.

AMuzi writes:

On 6/9/2021 3:41 PM, Radey Shouman wrote:
AMuzi writes:

On 6/9/2021 1:05 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 6/9/2021 1:39 PM, AMuzi wrote:

[ ... ]

Meanwhile the border is open.

https://wflanews.iheart.com/featured...-county-woman/


CBP agents report that most of the staff has been
reassigned to processing of illegals rather than actual
border enforcement. There are virtually no deportations
any longer. And those 'helpless children' are 90% single
males between 15 and 21.

These are not new problems and a complete solution is not
possible but these are real problems:

https://policetribune.com/advocate-f...rtation-order/


The border is not "open" any more than all bike shops are
always "open." Bike shop and other burglaries happen despite
reasonable security.

Actually, your position on this is sort of flipped from your
usual position. You've repeatedly argued against gun laws,
saying "How is the prohibition on drugs working out?".

For consistency, you should be saying we shouldn't have
border security.


Extend the argument and you get to 'we are not a nation'. That's too
far over the line for me.

No visas were required for aliens wishing to enter the US prior to 1918,
were we not then a nation?


That's insightful. So I thought about it.

A lot has changed.

In 1900, total US tax burden, local, county, state and federal was
under 10% of GDP. One might bemoan the ethos 'work or starve' but
that's how it was generally.

As Milton Friedman famously concluded 'You can have a welfare state or
open borders, but not both.' I think he makes a very good point.

Add in other social/cultural changes and open borders are IMHO a clear
and present danger. We have plenty of dangers here already.

The cost of social welfare is one part of the puzzle, another one is
just the increasing ability of states to micromanage people. When
Fernando and Ysabel kicked all the Muslims and Jews out of Spain no one
objected that they weren't allowed to do that -- they were sovereign.
But the modern beaurocratic centralized approach of passports for all
with a stamp for each coming and going was just not doable, so they had
to rely on the Spanish Inquisition.

It's true that detailed migration control has become a sine qua non for
a state above the failed level, like a highway system or a working
airport. It's useful to remember that those requirements are of a
similar age.

I'm not ready to advocate open borders, but I do object to the idea that
they are literally unthinkable. Most of the world had them not all that
long ago.

On Thursday, June 10, 2021 at 7:55:21 AM UTC-7, Radey Shouman wrote:
AMuzi writes:

On 6/9/2021 3:41 PM, Radey Shouman wrote:
AMuzi writes:

On 6/9/2021 1:05 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 6/9/2021 1:39 PM, AMuzi wrote:
[ ... ]
Meanwhile the border is open.

https://wflanews.iheart.com/featured...-county-woman/


CBP agents report that most of the staff has been
reassigned to processing of illegals rather than actual
border enforcement. There are virtually no deportations
any longer. And those 'helpless children' are 90% single
males between 15 and 21.

These are not new problems and a complete solution is not
possible but these are real problems:

https://policetribune.com/advocate-f...rtation-order/


The border is not "open" any more than all bike shops are
always "open." Bike shop and other burglaries happen despite
reasonable security.

Actually, your position on this is sort of flipped from your
usual position. You've repeatedly argued against gun laws,
saying "How is the prohibition on drugs working out?".

For consistency, you should be saying we shouldn't have
border security.


Extend the argument and you get to 'we are not a nation'. That's too
far over the line for me.

No visas were required for aliens wishing to enter the US prior to 1918,
were we not then a nation?


That's insightful. So I thought about it.

A lot has changed.

In 1900, total US tax burden, local, county, state and federal was
under 10% of GDP. One might bemoan the ethos 'work or starve' but
that's how it was generally.

As Milton Friedman famously concluded 'You can have a welfare state or
open borders, but not both.' I think he makes a very good point.

Add in other social/cultural changes and open borders are IMHO a clear
and present danger. We have plenty of dangers here already.
The cost of social welfare is one part of the puzzle, another one is
just the increasing ability of states to micromanage people. When
Fernando and Ysabel kicked all the Muslims and Jews out of Spain no one
objected that they weren't allowed to do that -- they were sovereign.
But the modern beaurocratic centralized approach of passports for all
with a stamp for each coming and going was just not doable, so they had
to rely on the Spanish Inquisition.

It's true that detailed migration control has become a sine qua non for
a state above the failed level, like a highway system or a working
airport. It's useful to remember that those requirements are of a
similar age.

I'm not ready to advocate open borders, but I do object to the idea that
they are literally unthinkable. Most of the world had them not all that
long ago.
Most of the world does NOT have open borders. Even in the EU they have immigration controls and even those are so lax that they got themselves Brexit. If YOU think that you can immigrate to China just try it. If you think that you can immigrate to Russia try it. Socialist Countries are the LEAST open because they already cannot pay for their own populations of natives.