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#11
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In article , MagillaGorilla
wrote: Casey Kerrigan wrote: In article , MagillaGorilla wrote: happen. Also, blame the promoters of Redlands and Superweek who are also violating USAC rules by not requiring Fuentes to return his money. The reality is the promoters don't want to be bothered with having to redistribute all the money to racers who would be moved up a place because of Neben's annd Fuentes DQ. In checking out the rule book I find rule 1C3 which says that a rider DQed for a medical control infraction must return any prizes and primes won in the event... The rule doesn't say that the rider must return any prizes won while appealing a medical control violation. Did Fuentes ride well enough to earn any prizes at Redlands? If yes then under the rules he would have to return those prizes. Since the rule doesn't mention having to return prizes earned while appealing ( although it would make sense logically) I don't see where he is required to return any other prizes. Fuentes was DQ'ed from Redlands and EVERY race after that by the CAS ruling. So he WOULD have to return that prize money during his appeal process. But that isn't how the rule reads. The rule says the event ( ie a single event). The rule doesn't say that prizes have to be returned for events ridden during appeal. Also it would be a huge pain trying to redistribute all the prizes over all the different races he placed in since Redlands. I thought you would be more upset over the fact that Fuents is really only getting a 1 year suspension since he got to race all of this year and will only be suspended from now until March 25th 2006. |
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#12
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Casey Kerrigan wrote:
In article , MagillaGorilla wrote: Casey Kerrigan wrote: In article , MagillaGorilla wrote: happen. Also, blame the promoters of Redlands and Superweek who are also violating USAC rules by not requiring Fuentes to return his money. The reality is the promoters don't want to be bothered with having to redistribute all the money to racers who would be moved up a place because of Neben's annd Fuentes DQ. In checking out the rule book I find rule 1C3 which says that a rider DQed for a medical control infraction must return any prizes and primes won in the event... The rule doesn't say that the rider must return any prizes won while appealing a medical control violation. Did Fuentes ride well enough to earn any prizes at Redlands? If yes then under the rules he would have to return those prizes. Since the rule doesn't mention having to return prizes earned while appealing ( although it would make sense logically) I don't see where he is required to return any other prizes. Fuentes was DQ'ed from Redlands and EVERY race after that by the CAS ruling. So he WOULD have to return that prize money during his appeal process. But that isn't how the rule reads. The rule says the event ( ie a single event). The rule doesn't say that prizes have to be returned for events ridden during appeal. Also it would be a huge pain trying to redistribute all the prizes over all the different races he placed in since Redlands. I thought you would be more upset over the fact that Fuents is really only getting a 1 year suspension since he got to race all of this year and will only be suspended from now until March 25th 2006. Hey Casey, You don't appear to have very goood reading comprehension. Pay attention: 1. Fuentes and Neben were DQ'ed by the CAS from ALL of their races after their positive test. 2. The rules state that prize money must be refunded from races in which a rider was DQ'ed from as a result of a drug sanction, which includes ANY RACE the CAS states the rider was DQ'ed from in their ruling. 3. It doesn't matter if it would be a "huge pain in the ass" to redistribute the prize money. The rules are the rules. Magilla |
#13
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Casey Kerrigan wrote:
In article , MagillaGorilla wrote: Casey Kerrigan wrote: In article , MagillaGorilla wrote: happen. Also, blame the promoters of Redlands and Superweek who are also violating USAC rules by not requiring Fuentes to return his money. The reality is the promoters don't want to be bothered with having to redistribute all the money to racers who would be moved up a place because of Neben's annd Fuentes DQ. In checking out the rule book I find rule 1C3 which says that a rider DQed for a medical control infraction must return any prizes and primes won in the event... The rule doesn't say that the rider must return any prizes won while appealing a medical control violation. Did Fuentes ride well enough to earn any prizes at Redlands? If yes then under the rules he would have to return those prizes. Since the rule doesn't mention having to return prizes earned while appealing ( although it would make sense logically) I don't see where he is required to return any other prizes. Fuentes was DQ'ed from Redlands and EVERY race after that by the CAS ruling. So he WOULD have to return that prize money during his appeal process. But that isn't how the rule reads. The rule says the event ( ie a single event). The rule doesn't say that prizes have to be returned for events ridden during appeal. Also it would be a huge pain trying to redistribute all the prizes over all the different races he placed in since Redlands. I thought you would be more upset over the fact that Fuents is really only getting a 1 year suspension since he got to race all of this year and will only be suspended from now until March 25th 2006. Hey Casey, You don't appear to have very goood reading comprehension. Pay attention: 1. Fuentes and Neben were DQ'ed by the CAS from ALL of their races after their positive test. 2. The rules state that prize money must be refunded from races in which a rider was DQ'ed from as a result of a drug sanction, which includes ANY RACE the CAS states the rider was DQ'ed from in their ruling. 3. It doesn't matter if it would be a "huge pain in the ass" to redistribute the prize money. The rules are the rules. Magilla |
#14
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In article , MagillaGorilla
wrote: Hey Casey, You don't appear to have very goood reading comprehension. Pay attention: 1. Fuentes and Neben were DQ'ed by the CAS from ALL of their races after their positive test. 2. The rules state that prize money must be refunded from races in which a rider was DQ'ed from as a result of a drug sanction, which includes ANY RACE the CAS states the rider was DQ'ed from in their ruling. Ok please provide the word for word rule ( and note where others can look it up) in question. I stated the only rule I could find in the rule book dealilng with this issue 1C3 in the USCF rule book 3. It doesn't matter if it would be a "huge pain in the ass" to redistribute the prize money. The rules are the rules. Yup the rules are the rules and in this case as I read it rule 1C3 only applies to the initial race that the rider is foud guilty of doping at. Magilla |
#15
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In article , MagillaGorilla
wrote: Hey Casey, You don't appear to have very goood reading comprehension. Pay attention: 1. Fuentes and Neben were DQ'ed by the CAS from ALL of their races after their positive test. 2. The rules state that prize money must be refunded from races in which a rider was DQ'ed from as a result of a drug sanction, which includes ANY RACE the CAS states the rider was DQ'ed from in their ruling. Ok please provide the word for word rule ( and note where others can look it up) in question. I stated the only rule I could find in the rule book dealilng with this issue 1C3 in the USCF rule book 3. It doesn't matter if it would be a "huge pain in the ass" to redistribute the prize money. The rules are the rules. Yup the rules are the rules and in this case as I read it rule 1C3 only applies to the initial race that the rider is foud guilty of doping at. Magilla |
#16
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Casey Kerrigan wrote:
In article , MagillaGorilla wrote: Hey Casey, You don't appear to have very goood reading comprehension. Pay attention: 1. Fuentes and Neben were DQ'ed by the CAS from ALL of their races after their positive test. 2. The rules state that prize money must be refunded from races in which a rider was DQ'ed from as a result of a drug sanction, which includes ANY RACE the CAS states the rider was DQ'ed from in their ruling. Ok please provide the word for word rule ( and note where others can look it up) in question. I stated the only rule I could find in the rule book dealilng with this issue 1C3 in the USCF rule book 3. It doesn't matter if it would be a "huge pain in the ass" to redistribute the prize money. The rules are the rules. Yup the rules are the rules and in this case as I read it rule 1C3 only applies to the initial race that the rider is foud guilty of doping at. Magilla Casey, If the Court of Arbitration for Sport DQ's you from 5 races, you have to return all your prize money from those 5 races because the rules state that prize money must be returned from a race in which you were DQ'ed. ------ 1A20. Disqualification is a penalty that causes a rider or team to lose placing in a race and to be ineligible for any subsequent heats in the race. 1N7. Disqualification. In races consisting ordinarily of qualification, semifinal, and final rounds, the disqualification of a rider or team after the finals shall not change the placings of other riders. In other races, when a rider or team is removed from the placings by disqualification, any lower placed riders will be advanced to their next higher finishing place. 1C3.. A rider who is disqualified for a medical control infraction must promptly return any prizes and primes won in the event, though this obligation shall be stayed while a hearing is pending. -------------------------------------- Now pay attention, Casey: IC3 has to apply to all the races, and NOT just the event for which the rider tested positive because: 1. You cannot be disqualified from a race by the CAS (regardless of the reason) and still take the prize money for placing say, second. Why, you ask? BECAUSE YOU WERE ****ING DISQUALIFIED FROM SECOND PLACE BY THE CAS AND THEREFORE YOU NEVER GOT SECOND PLACE IN THAT RACE. SO ON WHAT BASIS ARE YOU KEEPING THE SECOOND PLACE PRIZE MONEY? DQ MEANS DQ. IT MEANS YOU NEVER GOT SECOND PLACE. 2. RULE 1C3 is superseded by CAS rulings (see #4 below) 3. IC3 does not state a rider CAN keep prize money from a race in which he or she was disqualified by the CAS. IC3 only says that you must return prize money from the event in which you failed the medical control. So IC3 is not relevant. However the CAS ruling is. 4. [page 149] II. Medical Control Section 1. USA Cycling has adopted and participates in the United States Anti-Doping Agency (USADA) protocol for Olympic Movement testing (USADA protocol). The USADA protocol is incorporated herein by reference and shall prevail over any USA Cycling Regulation to the contrary. Their medical control regulations shall apply to USA Cycling, its Associations, and all members, licensees, participants in races granted permits by USA Cycling or Associations, and organizations affiliated with USA Cycling or Associations. The CAS process is part of the USADA Protocol, so therefore it's included in II. Medical Control. Take care, Magilla |
#17
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Casey Kerrigan wrote:
In article , MagillaGorilla wrote: Hey Casey, You don't appear to have very goood reading comprehension. Pay attention: 1. Fuentes and Neben were DQ'ed by the CAS from ALL of their races after their positive test. 2. The rules state that prize money must be refunded from races in which a rider was DQ'ed from as a result of a drug sanction, which includes ANY RACE the CAS states the rider was DQ'ed from in their ruling. Ok please provide the word for word rule ( and note where others can look it up) in question. I stated the only rule I could find in the rule book dealilng with this issue 1C3 in the USCF rule book 3. It doesn't matter if it would be a "huge pain in the ass" to redistribute the prize money. The rules are the rules. Yup the rules are the rules and in this case as I read it rule 1C3 only applies to the initial race that the rider is foud guilty of doping at. Magilla Casey, If the Court of Arbitration for Sport DQ's you from 5 races, you have to return all your prize money from those 5 races because the rules state that prize money must be returned from a race in which you were DQ'ed. ------ 1A20. Disqualification is a penalty that causes a rider or team to lose placing in a race and to be ineligible for any subsequent heats in the race. 1N7. Disqualification. In races consisting ordinarily of qualification, semifinal, and final rounds, the disqualification of a rider or team after the finals shall not change the placings of other riders. In other races, when a rider or team is removed from the placings by disqualification, any lower placed riders will be advanced to their next higher finishing place. 1C3.. A rider who is disqualified for a medical control infraction must promptly return any prizes and primes won in the event, though this obligation shall be stayed while a hearing is pending. -------------------------------------- Now pay attention, Casey: IC3 has to apply to all the races, and NOT just the event for which the rider tested positive because: 1. You cannot be disqualified from a race by the CAS (regardless of the reason) and still take the prize money for placing say, second. Why, you ask? BECAUSE YOU WERE ****ING DISQUALIFIED FROM SECOND PLACE BY THE CAS AND THEREFORE YOU NEVER GOT SECOND PLACE IN THAT RACE. SO ON WHAT BASIS ARE YOU KEEPING THE SECOOND PLACE PRIZE MONEY? DQ MEANS DQ. IT MEANS YOU NEVER GOT SECOND PLACE. 2. RULE 1C3 is superseded by CAS rulings (see #4 below) 3. IC3 does not state a rider CAN keep prize money from a race in which he or she was disqualified by the CAS. IC3 only says that you must return prize money from the event in which you failed the medical control. So IC3 is not relevant. However the CAS ruling is. 4. [page 149] II. Medical Control Section 1. USA Cycling has adopted and participates in the United States Anti-Doping Agency (USADA) protocol for Olympic Movement testing (USADA protocol). The USADA protocol is incorporated herein by reference and shall prevail over any USA Cycling Regulation to the contrary. Their medical control regulations shall apply to USA Cycling, its Associations, and all members, licensees, participants in races granted permits by USA Cycling or Associations, and organizations affiliated with USA Cycling or Associations. The CAS process is part of the USADA Protocol, so therefore it's included in II. Medical Control. Take care, Magilla |
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