O/T: knots

Hi, this isn't about bicycles,...

I was reviewing knots from my old boy scout and sailing
daze, and could remember just four. Getting old sux -

There are plenty of well illustrated books. I figure
I can learn 10 - 12. So, I'm looking for suggestions, a list.

Why am I posting this question here? There must be a
few bike mechanics on this board, and mechanics
know lots of technical tricks - including maybe, rope -

Anyway, I'm looking for a 'most useful' list - so tell
not only which ones to focus on, but why, what's the app?


--
Rich

- rdelaney / Sat, 12 Dec 2015 00:53:09 +0100


Anyway, I'm looking for a 'most useful' list - so tell
not only which ones to focus on, but why, what's the app?

Forget about old-school.

Cable-ties are state of the art.



jk



.... and try to configure your news-reader in a way that
your name will appear in the 'message-from' line, tsx


--
no sig

"Jakob Krieger" wrote in news[email protected]
2.fritz.box:

- rdelaney / Sat, 12 Dec 2015 00:53:09 +0100

Anyway, I'm looking for a 'most useful' list - so tell
not only which ones to focus on, but why, what's the app?

Forget about old-school.

Cable-ties are state of the art.

Unless you're trying to repair tubulars, in which case go to the library and
take out a book.
--
Andrew Chaplin
SIT MIHI GLADIUS SICUT SANCTO MARTINO
(If you're going to e-mail me, you'll have to get "yourfinger." out.)

- Andrew Chaplin / Sat, 12 Dec 2015 01:14:01 +0100


Anyway, I'm looking for a 'most useful' list - so tell
not only which ones to focus on, but why, what's the app?

Forget about old-school.

Cable-ties are state of the art.

Unless you're trying to repair tubulars, in which case go to the library and
take out a book.

GOOD cable-ties also repair a punctured tube.
One right and one left of the leak.

You just have to tear them tightly.


jk


--
no sig

On Fri, 11 Dec 2015 15:53:09 -0800 (PST),
wrote:

Hi, this isn't about bicycles,...

I was reviewing knots from my old boy scout and sailing
daze, and could remember just four. Getting old sux -

There are plenty of well illustrated books. I figure
I can learn 10 - 12. So, I'm looking for suggestions, a list.

Why am I posting this question here? There must be a
few bike mechanics on this board, and mechanics
know lots of technical tricks - including maybe, rope -

Anyway, I'm looking for a 'most useful' list - so tell
not only which ones to focus on, but why, what's the app?

What knots one uses is very dependent on what one does :-) but on the
other hand one uses perhaps one or two in daily life so the rest are
immaterial.

A modern sailor, for example uses one or two (disregarding one's dress
shoes) the square knot and a bowline.
--
cheers,

John B.

On Fri, 11 Dec 2015 15:53:09 -0800 (PST),
wrote:

Anyway, I'm looking for a 'most useful' list

The half hitch, basis of all knots.

The grand old square knot.

The surgeon's knot, when a square knot won't stay tight long enough to
make the second half hitch.

The slipped square knot, aka bow knot or shoelace knot, for when you
may need to untie it. Tip: to easily untie a plain square knot, pull
on both ends of the same rope until it is straight. Then the other
rope will be two half hitches that easily slide off the first rope.

The clove hitch.

The slipped clove hitch, aka miller's knot. (I learned that one by
studying a sack of flour I'd bought from a miller.) The only way to
tie a sack shut if you want to open it and then close it again with
the same twine. (But a clove hitch will do.)

The sheet bend, aka weaver's knot. Used to join two lines end-to-end.

I've never had much use for the bowline, but it comes free with the
sheet bend.

The cow hitch, for attaching a rubber band to a folding clothes-drying
rack so it can be stretched over the joint after the rack is set up.
Also useful for attaching a camera strap to a GPS. Useful any time
you want to attach the bight of a line to an object.

Or, to wrench this back onto cycling, I use a cow hitch to attach my
garters to one of the safety pins I pin the ankles of my sweat pants
with, then use the other safety pin to anchor this pin to said sweat
pants before I hang them up. When I open the pin, the cow hitch
undoes itself.

--
Joy Beeson
joy beeson at comcast dot net
http://wlweather.net/PAGEJOY/

On Mon, 14 Dec 2015 21:16:37 +0000, Phil W Lee
wrote:

John B. considered Sat, 12 Dec 2015 08:25:57
+0700 the perfect time to write:

On Fri, 11 Dec 2015 15:53:09 -0800 (PST),
wrote:

Hi, this isn't about bicycles,...

I was reviewing knots from my old boy scout and sailing
daze, and could remember just four. Getting old sux -

There are plenty of well illustrated books. I figure
I can learn 10 - 12. So, I'm looking for suggestions, a list.

Why am I posting this question here? There must be a
few bike mechanics on this board, and mechanics
know lots of technical tricks - including maybe, rope -

Anyway, I'm looking for a 'most useful' list - so tell
not only which ones to focus on, but why, what's the app?

What knots one uses is very dependent on what one does :-) but on the
other hand one uses perhaps one or two in daily life so the rest are
immaterial.

Partly true - you use what you know (even if it's less than ideal for
the intended purpose), and most people only know one or two. But
different knots have different uses, and "knots" covers a wide range
of different types - bends, stoppers, hitches, lashings, whippings,
splices, etc.

A modern sailor, for example uses one or two (disregarding one's dress
shoes) the square knot and a bowline.

That depends on how much of his own maintenance he does.
What you describe may well be true of what we used to call "yachties"
when I lived in Burnham-on-Crouch (weekenders, who came down to sail
their boats, but used a yard to look after them, and tended to be the
worst for needing dragging off mudbanks and other types of rescue),
but is far from true for those who take a pride in maintaining their
own boat in good condition, live on it on a low budget, or use it for
long distance cruising or ocean racing.

No, I was describing people that largely live on boats (yachts) and
journey to far off places. The bulk of the folks in the marina I used
to keep my boat (when I had one) in had come from Europe, The U.S.,
Australia, Half the world away.

But what sort of exotic reefs and bends do you think people use in
these days of aluminum spars and synthetic ropes?

My wife and I lived on a 40 ft. fiberglass boat for 15 years and the
only knot I remember using regularly was when I tied the dinghy
painter to the rail.
--
cheers,

John B.

- John B. / Tue, 15 Dec 2015 00:58:10 +0100


But what sort of exotic reefs and bends do you think people use in
these days of aluminum spars and synthetic ropes?

Well, seamens' knots have one thing in common:
They stay tight, but can be opened quite easily -
unlike the parcel knot that is best opened with a knife.

Then there are two main classes:
1 the ones that tighten when pulled
(like the reef-knot, sheet-bend, or the lynch knot)
2 the ones that keep-up a sling which does not tighten,
like the palstek (bowline knot) e.g. for rescue purpose
(not strangulating the victim)

Of course with plastic ropes and fixtures,
you don't need a knot any more for many things.

But for rescuing »man overboard« or joinig ropes
for more length, classical knots are still used.


May be except for GPS sailors, they don't know
what a knot or even a rope is.

When they go to disembark, they don't try to approach
a footbridge and tie the boat, but crash at beach low-waters
and buy a new boat for continuing their sailing trip.


[I was a inland-lake sports sailer in long-ago younger years,
and in my dreams, I surrounded earth at least twice
wich a shabby plastic dinghy -- so I MUST know]



jk



--
no sig

On Tue, 15 Dec 2015 03:38:45 +0100, "Jakob Krieger"
wrote:

- John B. / Tue, 15 Dec 2015 00:58:10 +0100


But what sort of exotic reefs and bends do you think people use in
these days of aluminum spars and synthetic ropes?

Well, seamens' knots have one thing in common:
They stay tight, but can be opened quite easily -
unlike the parcel knot that is best opened with a knife.

Then there are two main classes:
1 the ones that tighten when pulled
(like the reef-knot, sheet-bend, or the lynch knot)
2 the ones that keep-up a sling which does not tighten,
like the palstek (bowline knot) e.g. for rescue purpose
(not strangulating the victim)

Of course with plastic ropes and fixtures,
you don't need a knot any more for many things.

But for rescuing »man overboard« or joinig ropes
for more length, classical knots are still used.


What ropes would that be? The main halyard? About 80% wire rope? The
main sheet? Wire again, or the jib sheet... wire once again. I only
see rope on little boats that go zigging and zagging around the
harbour on Sunday afternoon.


May be except for GPS sailors, they don't know
what a knot or even a rope is.

Sort of snarky remark isn't it? After all big ships navigate with GPS,
airplanes navigate with GPS. It has been quite a number of years now
since anything commercial used the stars.

When they go to disembark, they don't try to approach
a footbridge and tie the boat, but crash at beach low-waters
and buy a new boat for continuing their sailing trip.


[I was a inland-lake sports sailer in long-ago younger years,
and in my dreams, I surrounded earth at least twice
wich a shabby plastic dinghy -- so I MUST know]



jk
--
cheers,

John B.

On December 11, Joy Beeson wrote:
Anyway, I'm looking for a 'most useful' list

The grand old square knot.
The sheet bend, aka weaver's knot. Used to join two lines end-to-end.

When/whatfor does one use a sheet bend, vs. a square knot?

They look alike, except the square knot is much easier to tie.

I've never had much use for the bowline, but it comes free with the
sheet bend.

?

--
Rich