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#21
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"Fuentes disputes positive" or How the USCF promotes doping...
"Stewart Fleming" wrote in message
... Bob Schwartz wrote: One would imagine that steriods are the most abused performance drug but the testing does not support that. Out of those 6890 tests only 18 came up positive under 'Anabolic Agents'. Four of those were from the Balco THG crowd, another 6 were Nandrolone-Oh-my-God-I-took-a- Forgot to mention, the only revelation in Swart's TV interview that was news to me was that THG was specifically designed to disintegrate during the testing process. Anyone got confirmation on that? (I hadn't heard that claimed before, is all) I hadn't heard that, but it is theoretically possible, at least if the steriod testing is done using electron impact gas chromatography mass spectrometry (the most common method for identifying drugs and/or their metabolites in biological fluids). If so, you'd build into the molecule some particularly weak structure/bonds, most likely away from the active part of the compound. That would result in greater fragmentation in the EI source, yielding ions of lower mass than those being scanned for. Andy Coggan |
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#22
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"Fuentes disputes positive" or How the USCF promotes doping...
"Sam" wrote in message
ink.net... You people have no clue. I agree. Andy Coggan |
#24
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"Fuentes disputes positive" or How the USCF promotes doping...
(crit pro) wrote in message . com...
wrote Rumors have surrounded this guy for a while now. I personally do not know him, but have ended up on the podium with him several times and honestly have no ill feelings toward him. I tended to chalk up the rumors to guys that were a little jealous of his results. In my naivety, I thought that "Local" guys just didn't dope. The bigger question I have after reading this is: Why the F@#$ is he being allowed to race after this positive test?!! Positive 4 months ago and still racing. What is to dispute? Is there anyway this could reasonably be a false positive? At Superweek he was flying and in hindsight taking $ out of clean riders pockets. What message does this send? The U.S. Anti-Doping Agency (USADA) has announced that Californian Dave Fuentes is currently involved in the USADA adjudication process after returning a positive test for oxymetholone metabolites at the Redlands Classic on March 25, 2004. The bigger question is when will Dave refund the stolen prize money he cheated his fellow bike racers out of at Superweek in July? Go to www.internationalcycling.com for the skinny. He won the Sprinters Jersey. That is a $5000 competition divided by top 5. So conservatively $2000. He won at least one stage of the 16 race long series. The daily list is for $2800, and the winner probably nets around $600. He placed 11th in the overall classification. That probably means a few more hundred dollars. So we'll say $3000 so far in the cheat's pocket. He placed highly in many of those races, as evidenced by his 11th overall. So I'll guess another $1000 in stage money. $4000 so far. He probably took some rich primes. Eddie Van Guys can answer this one. They have a star * legend for Super Prime days. One thru Five stars. Schlitz Park was a 5 star day. That means $15,000 in primes in that 100k criterium. I'll guess about $1000 in primes. I bet it is more like $2000-3000 for Dave the drug Slave Fuentes. So that makes $5000. $5000 CASH. No taxes. Maybe more. minus the pharmacy fee. minus a few friends in the races. Still BIG money. Who knows how much he split back, helping the comeback kid McCook to his best racing in 10 years. That is money from honest hard working souls who gave their all. This guy is despicable. He rode like a ****ing ROCKET in July. Busted earlier for drugs, was still his dirty little secret with each dollar made. He was sprinting like a madman. It was unreal. He was making/driving breaks. Like a motorcycle. This should be a police matter. The Milwaukee Police should investigate the THEFT of over $5000 from the competitors at Superweek 2004. Hope your dad reads this, Dave. He must be real proud of what you have become. A 31 year old bum, who steals to support an illegal drug habit. A true role model for the hundreds of children who cheered for you in July. Go away. Crit Pro FWIW, Fuentes has been crushing fields in NorCal for years. Just sayin'. |
#25
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"Fuentes disputes positive" or How the USCF promotes doping...
So $4.4 million to conduct 6890 tests - that's about $650 per test,
which is pretty steep in the medical realm but may not be unreasonable considering all the ancillary costs. In any case, though, I can't help but wonder where the people who call for a huge increase in testing expect the money to come from...for example, would they be willing to pay an extra $50 for their annual license to help support expanded testing? I bet that most would not. Andy Coggan well US PRO charges US domestic teams almost $10,000 for UCI registration and provides virtually no service for that fee. It would be nice to see some of that money allocated for testing. Beyond that, I'd be willing to pay an additional $1000-$2000 to that team fee if I could be assured that the money would go directly to the testing of cyclists in and out of competition. With a dozen teams or so, that would be 20-40 additional cycling tests. I also think it reasonsable to make some in competition testing as a requirement for events of a certain threshold. Perhaps category A and or B races must either provide for testing or pay into a pool for random unannounced testing at a certain number of cat A and or B events. I would also suggest increasing the number of athletes in the testing pool to include all US Pro license holders. This would probably be outside of who the USADA needs to test but there is no reason that the funding mechanisms above could be used to allocate supplimental testing. People are doping...regularly. And I don't mean ephedrine. The Fuentes, Bergman, and DeCanio revelations are sad. And even sadder is that as long as this continues, the clean but successful athletes will always be suspected and their efforts doubted. Bill Laudien Sportsbook.com (Sponsor of the Sportsbook.com Sprinter's jersey (temporarily)won by Fuentes and who's team was cheated out of the gold medal round of the team pursuit by Adham Sbeih) |
#26
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"Fuentes disputes positive" or How the USCF promotes doping...
"Curtis L. Russell" wrote: Just a question - are the USADA rules for testing more stringent (i.e. more expensive) than that done 'locally'? If I want an employee tested, I can run the bill anywhere from $ 15 to about $ 150, and this is just from the smorgasbord of employee hiring tests, and of course is largely based on urine tests, pricing based on the range of substances tested for. Blood tests are a lot more expensive retail. The testing panels done for employers look only for the "recreational" drugs; cocaine, meth, pot, etc. They also use cheaper, easier methods for testing, some of which have questionable reliability. We had a triage test for "drugs of abuse" that was used at our hospital which was then backed up further testing which took a much longer time to produce results. We found the estimated accuracy, based on agreement with the back up testing, was only around 60%, i.e only slightly better than flipping a coin. We have now quit using that test. For athlete testing it is necessary to look at a much greater range of substances. Steroids, sympathomimetics, hormones, masking agents, etc. are not tested for in the panels sold to employers. The increased size of the market, lower number of agents tested for, lower accuracy methods used all combine to make employment test much less expensive than athletic testing. In addition, the testing done on athletes has really limited availability. I found this out several years ago when a team I was involved with wished to do testing on the members of the team for various reasons. At that point I thought that it would be possible to just get a "IOC panel" of tested done. Turns out that such an item is not available commercially. It would be possible to get a commercial test done for a list of possible agents but most are not group together into a panel of tests so each substance would require order a separate test, each test costing in the range of $100 or so. Even if we limited the testing to just the more common anabolics the price got out of hand very quickly. Mike Murray |
#27
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"Fuentes disputes positive" or How the USCF promotes doping...
Andy Coggan wrote:
In any case, though, I can't help but wonder where the people who call for a huge increase in testing expect the money to come from...for example, would they be willing to pay an extra $50 for their annual license to help support expanded testing? I bet that most would not. Currently two thirds of the budget comes from the federal government. Nothing comes from the participants or governing bodies. At the risk of launching tangential threads on the role of government and taxation I suggest that the money come from the same place it comes from now, just more of it. Bob Schwartz |
#28
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"Fuentes disputes positive" or How the USCF promotes doping...
"crit pro" wrote in message om... wrote Rumors have surrounded this guy for a while now. I personally do not know him, but have ended up on the podium with him several times and honestly have no ill feelings toward him. I tended to chalk up the rumors to guys that were a little jealous of his results. In my naivety, I thought that "Local" guys just didn't dope. The bigger question I have after reading this is: Why the F@#$ is he being allowed to race after this positive test?!! Positive 4 months ago and still racing. What is to dispute? Is there anyway this could reasonably be a false positive? At Superweek he was flying and in hindsight taking $ out of clean riders pockets. What message does this send? The U.S. Anti-Doping Agency (USADA) has announced that Californian Dave Fuentes is currently involved in the USADA adjudication process after returning a positive test for oxymetholone metabolites at the Redlands Classic on March 25, 2004. The bigger question is when will Dave refund the stolen prize money he cheated his fellow bike racers out of at Superweek in July? Go to www.internationalcycling.com for the skinny. He won the Sprinters Jersey. That is a $5000 competition divided by top 5. So conservatively $2000. He won at least one stage of the 16 race long series. The daily list is for $2800, and the winner probably nets around $600. He placed 11th in the overall classification. That probably means a few more hundred dollars. So we'll say $3000 so far in the cheat's pocket. He placed highly in many of those races, as evidenced by his 11th overall. So I'll guess another $1000 in stage money. $4000 so far. He probably took some rich primes. Eddie Van Guys can answer this one. They have a star * legend for Super Prime days. One thru Five stars. Schlitz Park was a 5 star day. That means $15,000 in primes in that 100k criterium. I'll guess about $1000 in primes. I bet it is more like $2000-3000 for Dave the drug Slave Fuentes. So that makes $5000. $5000 CASH. No taxes. Maybe more. minus the pharmacy fee. minus a few friends in the races. Still BIG money. Who knows how much he split back, helping the comeback kid McCook to his best racing in 10 years. That is money from honest hard working souls who gave their all. This guy is despicable. He rode like a ****ing ROCKET in July. Busted earlier for drugs, was still his dirty little secret with each dollar made. He was sprinting like a madman. It was unreal. He was making/driving breaks. Like a motorcycle. This should be a police matter. The Milwaukee Police should investigate the THEFT of over $5000 from the competitors at Superweek 2004. Hope your dad reads this, Dave. He must be real proud of what you have become. A 31 year old bum, who steals to support an illegal drug habit. A true role model for the hundreds of children who cheered for you in July. Go away. Crit Pro |
#29
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"Fuentes disputes positive" or How the USCF promotes doping...
"crit pro" wrote in message om... wrote Rumors have surrounded this guy for a while now. I personally do not know him, but have ended up on the podium with him several times and honestly have no ill feelings toward him. I tended to chalk up the rumors to guys that were a little jealous of his results. In my naivety, I thought that "Local" guys just didn't dope. The bigger question I have after reading this is: Why the F@#$ is he being allowed to race after this positive test?!! Positive 4 months ago and still racing. What is to dispute? Is there anyway this could reasonably be a false positive? At Superweek he was flying and in hindsight taking $ out of clean riders pockets. What message does this send? The U.S. Anti-Doping Agency (USADA) has announced that Californian Dave Fuentes is currently involved in the USADA adjudication process after returning a positive test for oxymetholone metabolites at the Redlands Classic on March 25, 2004. The bigger question is when will Dave refund the stolen prize money he cheated his fellow bike racers out of at Superweek in July? Go to www.internationalcycling.com for the skinny. He won the Sprinters Jersey. That is a $5000 competition divided by top 5. So conservatively $2000. He won at least one stage of the 16 race long series. The daily list is for $2800, and the winner probably nets around $600. He placed 11th in the overall classification. That probably means a few more hundred dollars. So we'll say $3000 so far in the cheat's pocket. WHAT HAVE "YOU" EVER WON?? He placed highly in many of those races, as evidenced by his 11th overall. So I'll guess another $1000 in stage money. $4000 so far. He probably took some rich primes. Eddie Van Guys can answer this one. They have a star * legend for Super Prime days. One thru Five stars. Schlitz Park was a 5 star day. That means $15,000 in primes in that 100k criterium. I'll guess about $1000 in primes. I bet it is more like $2000-3000 for Dave the drug Slave Fuentes. So that makes $5000. $5000 CASH. No taxes. Maybe more. minus the pharmacy fee. minus a few friends in the races. Still BIG money. Who knows how much he split back, helping the comeback kid McCook to his best racing in 10 years. That is money from honest hard working souls who gave their all. This guy is despicable. He rode like a ****ing ROCKET in July. Busted earlier for drugs, was still his dirty little secret with each dollar made. He was sprinting like a madman. It was unreal. He was making/driving breaks. Like a motorcycle. This should be a police matter. The Milwaukee Police should investigate the THEFT of over $5000 from the competitors at Superweek 2004. Hope your dad reads this, Dave. He must be real proud of what you have become. A 31 year old bum, who steals to support an illegal drug habit. A true role model for the hundreds of children who cheered for you in July. Go away. Crit Pro |
#30
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"Fuentes disputes positive" or How the USCF promotes doping...
Andy Coggan wrote:
So $4.4 million to conduct 6890 tests - that's about $650 per test, which is pretty steep in the medical realm but may not be unreasonable considering all the ancillary costs. Bill Laudien wrote: well US PRO charges US domestic teams almost $10,000 for UCI registration and provides virtually no service for that fee. It would be nice to see some of that money allocated for testing. Beyond that, I'd be willing to pay an additional $1000-$2000 to that team fee if I could be assured that the money would go directly to the testing of cyclists in and out of competition. With a dozen teams or so, that would be 20-40 additional cycling tests. Unlike Andy I'm no expert on the subject, but I wonder if increasing the number of tests would also decrease the cost per test ie a kind of mass production effect ? |
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